Hi John,
I don't understand what you are saying.   Are any of those you mentioned a
good enough reason to be tortured and burnt?

Jenny

----- Original Message -----
From: <BitsyCat1@...>
To: <GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 5:30 PM
Subject: Re: [GnosticThought] Re: A flash of light



In a message dated 12/02/2003 11:28:31 AM, jengo@... writes:


> Hi George,
> Tried that once before, think I was burned at the stake that time ;-)
>
>

  For what? Heresy , Witchcraft adultery, Joan of Arc was burned at the stake
you kno
Perhaps you should try to determine why?
regards johnmoon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







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Hi Martin,
You raise a good point  (heehee) concerning the sexuality of men.  Men are
not supposed to cry,  they have to be macho.  Women think that men equate
sex with love,  and  men think women equate an emotional bond with love.   I
think it's wrong  to generalise like that.   Every interaction with another
be it male or female should be taken on it's own merits and played out
uniquely according to the energies involved.
I don't know how correct the following is,  according to Jung.  He wrote :
Whereas logic and objectivity are usually the predominant features of a
man's outer attitude, or are at least regarded as ideals, in the case of a
woman it is feeling.  But in the soul it is the other way around:  inwardly
it is the man who feels, and the woman who reflects."  ....and...
It is almost a regular occurrence for a woman to be wholly contained,
spiritually,  in her husband   and for a husband to be  contained
emotionally,  in his wife.
I think that no matter what level or dimension the interaction between the
sexes,  there will always come into play the yin and yang,  positive and
negative polarities, complementing rather than opposing.

best wishes,
Jen





>  Do you think males and females can
> be friends, on many levels  without sexuality being part of it?
> I would like to know what others think and if it is possible for
others.

Yes it is possible - I think society is largely to blame by making men
feel inferior, doubting their own sexuality, if they do not have
sexual feelings for every pretty woman they see.

warm regards

Martin

>Do you also have people telling you that you are radiant and glow?  I have
>had that for a long time, but now it is such that people stare at me
>wherever I go...lol,  I almost feel like a celebrity.   In the past after
>certain meditations or spiritual practises,  I would 'veil'  myself,  as I
>found that if I didn't  certain people would swear at me and attack me for
>no apparent  reason.

Jenny,

You are radiant with the light of Achamoth/Wisdom.  This is exactly what Paul
warns women about in 1 Corinthians.  He tells us that a woman should have her
head covered while 'praying or prophesying'.  In Paul's time covering the head
meant wearing a veil.  Also for Paul both 'praying and prophesying' are states
of spiritual possession.  The reason Paul gives are twofold - it is shameful for
the woman not to be veiled in such a state and also 'because of the angels'.  If
she does not veil herself then Paul tells us that she should have her head shorn
which is the sign of an adulteress.

The Valentinian Gnostics connected this passage with the veiling of Achamoth as
she appeared before Jesus as is shown in the writings of Irenaeus.  Initially
she is veiled out of modesty but then recognising him as her husband she unveils
herself and runs to him.

Paul believed that a woman who is shining with the beauty of Achamoth should not
display herself in that state before the eyes of the vulgar or she plays the
adulteress.  Her beauty is for her husband - not, in this case, her worldly
husband but her spiritual husband.  It is for Jesus and it is for the children
of the bridal chamber whether male or female.

As for Paul's warning about the angels these are the angels of Yahweh the
lawgiver who is enraged by the idea that lowly man has within him the image of
Achamoth who is above him.  Quite naturally if you go walking around 'unveiled'
in such a state you are going to suffer the inconvenience of having the
messengers of Yahweh using passers-by to swear at you and attack you!


Stephen



-----------------------------------------------
Was Christianity founded by a woman?
www.bridalchamber.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Greg,
Naturally!   Also spirituality and sexuality are  related.  It is impossible
to evolve into higher consciousness without a true understanding of  sexual
energy.  Or so it seems to me.
I could be wrong,  to err is human  ;)
Jenny


Its Ok to acknowlege chemistry without taking action on it..Of course
there's a time to take action on it too......Greg


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Steve
> To: GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 5:01 PM
> Subject: [GnosticThought] Re: Platonic Friendship
>
>
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Jenny" <jengo@x> wrote:
> > Hello,
> > Does the term, 'platonic friendship'  have anything to do with
> Plato's
> > philosophies.  I  have not studied philosophy,  (would like to ).
> >
> > Platonic friendship seems to  be used in relationships where
> people of the
> > opposite sex  can be friends,  on an equal level,  non sexually.  I
> have
> > many male friends,  as well as gay male friends,  I treat all my
> friends,
> > regardless of sexual orientation,  the same.  My husband knows
> about all my
> > male friends,  knows that it is part of my spiritual quest.  If the
> energy
> > changes between myself and a male,  I cut ties with that person.  I
> can do
> > that,  but many can't understand this.  Do you think males and
> females can
> > be friends, on many levels  without sexuality being part of it?
> > I would like to know what others think and if it is possible for
> others.
> > Thank you.
> >
> > Jenny
> >
> > p.s  My yahoogroups email messages are bouncing so I am not getting
> all the
> > messages.  If I don't reply  it may be due to that.
>
> Hi, Jenny. Yes, I think it is possible. The trick is to be
> ruthlessly self-aware of your motives in dealing with others. This is
> never easy, since so much of our behavior is motivated by
> subconscious impulses. Yours, Steve W.
>
>
>       Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
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GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>

'Lost' Avebury stones discovered

An arc of buried megaliths that once formed part of the great stone circle
at Avebury in Wiltshire has been discovered.
A map of Avebury drawn up by William Stukely in the 1720s showed that many
of the stones in the south east and north east quadrants of the circle were
missing.

A survey of these areas by the National Trust has revealed that at least 15
of the megaliths lie buried in the circle itself.

The stones show up clearly on computer images and the National Trust has
been able to identify their sizes, the direction in which they are lying and
where they fit in the circle.

'Pagan symbols'

It is now considering using ground-probing radar to create three dimensional
images of each of the buried stones and raise them as computer images.

Martin Papworth, the National Trust's archaeologist for Wessex, said: "This
is a truly exciting find and completes the circle of Avebury.

"These stones were erected over 4,500 years ago and the world of archaeology
suspected that most of these stones had been demolished and lost forever.

"Until now, no-one had realised that some of these stones had survived
intact and that they actually lay buried in the earth, next to their
original locations.

"It is quite likely that they have lain there since the 13th and 14th
centuries, pushed over and buried there by the local population who may have
seen these pagan symbols as a threat to the established church."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/wiltshire/3257174.stm



    I thought this was interesting SOurce PAleo News

Regards johnmoon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi again Jenny,
    I agree with you that spirituality and sexuality are related...Sexuality was
regarded by the old mothergoddess traditions the highest form of spiritual
creativity..Sex was revered as a magical ,mysterious act of creation...According
to Druadic traditions SEX was LIFE...The attraction and dance between the sexes
constituted LIFE..The snake of biblical myth is considered to be the symbol of
Life engaged in the field of time..Sex may not only be Life,but also the
thresold from the spiritual into the field of time..
   Gnostica basically has one place their attention on the source of LIFE before
it enters the field of time..before it becomes the dance.....
   I prefer to view sex as a celibration of the magical mystery and wonder of
manifestation,however one can step beyond that.. Greg
----- Original Message -----
From: Jenny
To: GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: [GnosticThought] Platonic Friendship


Hi Greg,
Naturally!   Also spirituality and sexuality are  related.  It is impossible
to evolve into higher consciousness without a true understanding of  sexual
energy.  Or so it seems to me.
I could be wrong,  to err is human  ;)
Jenny


Its Ok to acknowlege chemistry without taking action on it..Of course
there's a time to take action on it too......Greg


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Steve
> To: GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 5:01 PM
> Subject: [GnosticThought] Re: Platonic Friendship
>
>
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Jenny" <jengo@x> wrote:
> > Hello,
> > Does the term, 'platonic friendship'  have anything to do with
> Plato's
> > philosophies.  I  have not studied philosophy,  (would like to ).
> >
> > Platonic friendship seems to  be used in relationships where
> people of the
> > opposite sex  can be friends,  on an equal level,  non sexually.  I
> have
> > many male friends,  as well as gay male friends,  I treat all my
> friends,
> > regardless of sexual orientation,  the same.  My husband knows
> about all my
> > male friends,  knows that it is part of my spiritual quest.  If the
> energy
> > changes between myself and a male,  I cut ties with that person.  I
> can do
> > that,  but many can't understand this.  Do you think males and
> females can
> > be friends, on many levels  without sexuality being part of it?
> > I would like to know what others think and if it is possible for
> others.
> > Thank you.
> >
> > Jenny
> >
> > p.s  My yahoogroups email messages are bouncing so I am not getting
> all the
> > messages.  If I don't reply  it may be due to that.
>
> Hi, Jenny. Yes, I think it is possible. The trick is to be
> ruthlessly self-aware of your motives in dealing with others. This is
> never easy, since so much of our behavior is motivated by
> subconscious impulses. Yours, Steve W.
>
>
>       Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>             ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>


       Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
             ADVERTISEMENT








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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <eugnostos2000@y...>
wrote:
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "scol202" <nalabox@n...>
wrote:
> > "And he [the beast] causeth all, both small and great, rich and
> poor,
> > free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in
their
> > foreheads: And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had
the
> > mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.(Rev.
> 13:16-
> > 17)"
> >
> > Hi there! I understand that in the 1st. century in Rome most
> commerce was regulated by trade guilds that incorporated pagan
ritual
> into their proceedings. Tatooing was used as identification for
some
> of the pagan cults. This would make it very difficult for
literalist
> Christians to buy or sell. I believe that 666 refered to Nero. I
> personally think that the strange imagery of the Seal Judgements
and
> Trumpet Judgements refered to the eruption of Mt. Vesuvius in 79
A.D.
> IMO, The Four Horsemen refered to the Jewish War of 70 A.D. The
1st
> Horseman on a white horse with a bow, who goes forth to conquer
and
> who receives a crown probably was Titus, who rode forth to conquer
> Jerusalem and who became empiror. Yours, Steve W.

What? A gnostic preterist? Now Ive seen it all.

Gipsyhex

"Ok... Im enlightened ...or maybe looney ...whats the diference?" ---
Rabi. Simeon A. Meek.

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Gregory Raymond" <GPR7@p...>
wrote:
> Hi again Jenny,
>    I agree with you that spirituality and sexuality are
related...Sexuality was regarded by the old mothergoddess traditions
the highest form of spiritual creativity..Sex was revered as a
magical ,mysterious act of creation...According to Druadic traditions
SEX was LIFE...The attraction and dance between the sexes constituted
LIFE..The snake of biblical myth is considered to be the symbol of
Life engaged in the field of time..Sex may not only be Life,but also
the thresold from the spiritual into the field of time..
>   Gnostica basically has one place their attention on the source of
LIFE before it enters the field of time..before it becomes the
dance.....
>   I prefer to view sex as a celibration of the magical mystery and
wonder of manifestation,however one can step beyond that.. Greg
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Jenny
> To: GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 10:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [GnosticThought] Platonic Friendship
>
>
> Hi Greg,
> Naturally!   Also spirituality and sexuality are  related.  It is
impossible
> to evolve into higher consciousness without a true understanding
of  sexual
> energy.  Or so it seems to me.
> I could be wrong,  to err is human  ;)
> Jenny

Hi Jenny and Greg,
I see sex as an important part of our physical nature. As a part of
the physical it has nothing to do with our spiritual side.

However IMO focus is the key to spiritual knowledge (Gnosis) and sex
is one area where most everyone can focus really well. So sex is a
powerful physical meditation technique and many use it for spiritual
advancement.

George

Hi John,
Thanks for the interesting article.  I somehow don't think the stones were
buried because of the established Church.  It will be interesting to see
where the stones are actually located.
Jenny

----- Original Message -----
From: <BitsyCat1@...>
To: <GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: [GnosticThought] Platonic Friendship


> 'Lost' Avebury stones discovered
>
> An arc of buried megaliths that once formed part of the great stone circle
> at Avebury in Wiltshire has been discovered.
> A map of Avebury drawn up by William Stukely in the 1720s showed that many
> of the stones in the south east and north east quadrants of the circle
were
> missing.
>
> A survey of these areas by the National Trust has revealed that at least
15
> of the megaliths lie buried in the circle itself.
>
> The stones show up clearly on computer images and the National Trust has
> been able to identify their sizes, the direction in which they are lying
and
> where they fit in the circle.
>
> 'Pagan symbols'
>
> It is now considering using ground-probing radar to create three
dimensional
> images of each of the buried stones and raise them as computer images.
>
> Martin Papworth, the National Trust's archaeologist for Wessex, said:
"This
> is a truly exciting find and completes the circle of Avebury.
>
> "These stones were erected over 4,500 years ago and the world of
archaeology
> suspected that most of these stones had been demolished and lost forever.
>
> "Until now, no-one had realised that some of these stones had survived
> intact and that they actually lay buried in the earth, next to their
> original locations.
>
> "It is quite likely that they have lain there since the 13th and 14th
> centuries, pushed over and buried there by the local population who may
have
> seen these pagan symbols as a threat to the established church."
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/wiltshire/3257174.stm
>
>
>
>    I thought this was interesting SOurce PAleo News
>
> Regards johnmoon3717@...
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

In a message dated 12/04/2003 11:44:59 AM, jengo@... writes:


> Hi John,
> Thanks for the interesting article.  I somehow don't think the stones were
> buried because of the established Church.  It will be interesting to see
> where the stones are actually located.
> Jenny
>

  Pagan symbols Pushed over and slowly covered by the earth, IM wondering what
it all looked like put back together.
  No more I suppose than say the Library of Alexandria Being burned out
because it contained Pagan material
  That happened anyway though
regard sjohnmoon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions and
Beliefs group.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/

The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the learning
process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on the
development of human life on earth's past, present and future. If this
force played a role on earth forming man's beliefs of Gods, or in his
evolution, what purpose is behind this? If the Religions of the world
came into existence without help from an outside source, what lead to
this need to develop Religions? This group wants to examine what are
facts and or fictions leading up to present day's issues. Since we are
striving to learn we request everyone to respect and remain open minded
to everyone else's beliefs and opinions.

Thank you for your time.

Richard

In a message dated 12/04/2003 05:09:33 PM, rpouncy@... writes:


> I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions and
> Beliefs group.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/
>
> The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the learning
> process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on the
> development of human life on earth's past, pr
>

  What Kind of outside f orce and is it outside or ind=side?
  What if everyone's looking in the wrong direction.
  We have ye t To explore inner space and the area between Atoms
The Nuclear and thermonuclear reactions should tell you that Power is not
Size oriented
just My Opinion
Regards johnmoon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I would agree with you as where is the force? Is it within or without?
For me I have learned that this force is within however it may not hold
true for everyone. This is the reason for this group and that is to
explore the possibilities without declaring who is right over another.

Richard.

>
>  What Kind of outside f orce and is it outside or ind=side?
>  What if everyone's looking in the wrong direction.
>  We have ye t To explore inner space and the area between Atoms
> The Nuclear and thermonuclear reactions should tell you that Power is
not
> Size oriented
> just My Opinion
> Regards johnmoon3717@...
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

In a message dated 12/04/2003 08:06:10 PM, rpouncy@... writes:


> I would agree with you as where is the force? Is it within or without?
> For me I have learned that this force is within however it may not hold
> true for everyone. This is the reason for this group and that is to
> explore the possibilities without declaring who is right over another.
>
>

  How could we tell we do not have the ability to analysise inner force we
merely see particles
and yet the universe is gradually increasing in size particles
  Perhaps the answer will always be elusive
Regard sjohnmon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Pouncy"
<rpouncy@s...> wrote:
> I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions and
> Beliefs group.
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/
>
> The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the
learning
> process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on the
> development of human life on earth's past, present and future. If
this
> force played a role on earth forming man's beliefs of Gods, or in
his
> evolution, what purpose is behind this? If the Religions of the
world
> came into existence without help from an outside source, what lead
to
> this need to develop Religions? This group wants to examine what are
> facts and or fictions leading up to present day's issues. Since we
are
> striving to learn we request everyone to respect and remain open
minded
> to everyone else's beliefs and opinions.
>
> Thank you for your time.
>
> Richard

Hi Richard,
I view religion as a necessary step in the process of waking up.

George

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, BitsyCat1@a... wrote:
>
> In a message dated 12/04/2003 05:09:33 PM, rpouncy@s... writes:
>
>
> > I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions
and
> > Beliefs group.
> >
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/
> >
> > The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the
learning
> > process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on the
> > development of human life on earth's past, pr
> >
>
>  What Kind of outside f orce and is it outside or ind=side?
>  What if everyone's looking in the wrong direction.
>  We have ye t To explore inner space and the area between Atoms
> The Nuclear and thermonuclear reactions should tell you that Power
is not
> Size oriented
> just My Opinion
> Regards johnmoon3717@a...

Hi John,
Good point. I see the force as being within us.

George

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Pouncy"
<rpouncy@s...> wrote:
>
>
> I would agree with you as where is the force? Is it within or
without?
> For me I have learned that this force is within however it may not
hold
> true for everyone. This is the reason for this group and that is to
> explore the possibilities without declaring who is right over
another.
>
> Richard.

Hi Richard,
You have been on this list long enough to know that we do that here
and that declaring who is right over another is also discouraged here.

Did you tell that other list about us?

George

Why does there have to be a force outside or inside of ourselves?

Suppose that this force that you speak of IS US?

Dominick

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "George Harvey"
<georgeatnsn@y...> wrote:
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, BitsyCat1@a... wrote:
> >
> > In a message dated 12/04/2003 05:09:33 PM, rpouncy@s... writes:
> >
> >
> > > I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions
> and
> > > Beliefs group.
> > >
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/
> > >
> > > The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the
> learning
> > > process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on
the
> > > development of human life on earth's past, pr
> > >
> >
> >  What Kind of outside f orce and is it outside or ind=side?
> >  What if everyone's looking in the wrong direction.
> >  We have ye t To explore inner space and the area between Atoms
> > The Nuclear and thermonuclear reactions should tell you that
Power
> is not
> > Size oriented
> > just My Opinion
> > Regards johnmoon3717@a...
>
> Hi John,
> Good point. I see the force as being within us.
>
> George

My Point is why only those 15 Stones, why not the others which were left
standing.

Jenny

----- Original Message -----
From: <BitsyCat1@...>
To: <GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2003 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: [GnosticThought] Platonic Friendship/Avebury



In a message dated 12/04/2003 11:44:59 AM, jengo@... writes:


> Hi John,
> Thanks for the interesting article. I somehow don't think the stones were
> buried because of the established Church. It will be interesting to see
> where the stones are actually located.
> Jenny
>

  Pagan symbols Pushed over and slowly covered by the earth, IM wondering
what
it all looked like put back together.
  No more I suppose than say the Library of Alexandria Being burned out
because it contained Pagan material
  That happened anyway though
regard sjohnmoon3717@...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Hi Stephen,  You wrote:

Jenny,

You are radiant with the light of Achamoth/Wisdom. This is exactly what Paul
warns women about in 1 Corinthians. He tells us that a woman should have her
head covered while 'praying or prophesying'. In Paul's time covering the
head
meant wearing a veil. Also for Paul both 'praying and prophesying' are
states
of spiritual possession. The reason Paul gives are twofold - it is shameful
for
the woman not to be veiled in such a state and also 'because of the angels'.
If
she does not veil herself then Paul tells us that she should have her head
shorn
which is the sign of an adulteress.

The Valentinian Gnostics connected this passage with the veiling of Achamoth
as
she appeared before Jesus as is shown in the writings of Irenaeus. Initially
she is veiled out of modesty but then recognising him as her husband she
unveils
herself and runs to him.

Paul believed that a woman who is shining with the beauty of Achamoth should
not
display herself in that state before the eyes of the vulgar or she plays the
adulteress. Her beauty is for her husband - not, in this case, her worldly
husband but her spiritual husband. It is for Jesus and it is for the
children
of the bridal chamber whether male or female.


Jenny:  Thank you,   I understand and naturally do not take the 'veiling'
literally as do some of the religions.

Whatever is within is also without,  and whatever is external can be found
internally.  There is a perfect eternal  blueprint.
Jenny

May the Force be with you!  ;-)


----- Original Message -----
From: "Dominick A. Versetto" <dominick@...>
To: <GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 6:39 AM
Subject: [GnosticThought] Re: An open invitation


> Why does there have to be a force outside or inside of ourselves?
>
> Suppose that this force that you speak of IS US?
>
> Dominick
>
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "George Harvey"
> <georgeatnsn@y...> wrote:
> > --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, BitsyCat1@a... wrote:
> > >
> > > In a message dated 12/04/2003 05:09:33 PM, rpouncy@s... writes:
> > >
> > >
> > > > I would like to extend a invitation to join the World Religions
> > and
> > > > Beliefs group.
> > > >
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/worldreligionsandbeliefs/
> > > >
> > > > The World Religions and Beliefs group, we are engaged in the
> > learning
> > > > process to determine whether an outside force had an effect on
> the
> > > > development of human life on earth's past, pr
> > > >
> > >
> > >  What Kind of outside f orce and is it outside or ind=side?
> > >  What if everyone's looking in the wrong direction.
> > >  We have ye t To explore inner space and the area between Atoms
> > > The Nuclear and thermonuclear reactions should tell you that
> Power
> > is not
> > > Size oriented
> > > just My Opinion
> > > Regards johnmoon3717@a...
> >
> > Hi John,
> > Good point. I see the force as being within us.
> >
> > George
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

Hello,

If one wishes to get an informed view on sex, I do recommend reading
the following, in full:

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/dp5/sex1.htm

It is is really intresting information.

Regards,
Steve

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Dominick A. Versetto"
<dominick@v...> wrote:
> Why does there have to be a force outside or inside of ourselves?
>
> Suppose that this force that you speak of IS US?
>
> Dominick

Hi Dominick,
What would be the difference between a force within ourselves and
ourselves? Looks like wordplay to me.

George

Hi George,

The difference is that having the force within ourselves implies that
we are vessels for the force. I'm suggesting that there is no
difference between what we are and the force itself.

I'm suggesting that maybe there is no mind/body, spiritual/physical,
body/soul dichotomy. I think there is a possibility that our
perception of being disconnected from other parts of the universe is
an illusion. It may just be that we are each a conscious part of a
greater whole. We need the misperception of individuality to make
this life meaningful. Actually, we all, collectively, may be one
consciousness.

I suppose we would still need to act as if the perception was
reality. Otherwise there would be no game.

Dominick

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "George Harvey"
<georgeatnsn@y...> wrote:
> --- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Dominick A. Versetto"
> <dominick@v...> wrote:
> > Why does there have to be a force outside or inside of ourselves?
> >
> > Suppose that this force that you speak of IS US?
> >
> > Dominick
>
> Hi Dominick,
> What would be the difference between a force within ourselves and
> ourselves? Looks like wordplay to me.
>
> George

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Dominick A. Versetto"
<dominick@v...> wrote:
> Hi George,
>
> The difference is that having the force within ourselves implies
that
> we are vessels for the force. I'm suggesting that there is no
> difference between what we are and the force itself.

Hi Dominick,
I see what you are saying. But to me it is basic Gnosticism that the
spiritual and physical are seperate is an illusion. The thing that is
in us is ourselves.

> I'm suggesting that maybe there is no mind/body,
spiritual/physical,
> body/soul dichotomy. I think there is a possibility that our
> perception of being disconnected from other parts of the universe
is
> an illusion.

Exactly. Again to me this is basic.

>It may just be that we are each a conscious part of a
> greater whole.

Right.

>We need the misperception of individuality to make
> this life meaningful. Actually, we all, collectively, may be one
> consciousness.

I think we are individuals and part of the whole at the same time.
Sort of like a cell in your body is an individual cell and a part of
your whole body at the same time.

>
> I suppose we would still need to act as if the perception was
> reality. Otherwise there would be no game.
>
> Dominick

I don't think there is a game. We are waking up.

George

Dear George;

In general, I would agree with your assessment however religion has also
become the most common source of oppression and reason for hatred.
Unlike mathematic which can be proven or disprove based upon research,
religion is based upon consensus or opinions.

Richard.

>
> Hi Richard,
> I view religion as a necessary step in the process of waking up.
>
> George
>

Dear Dominick;

You may be correct with your question, why could it not be humans that
is at the force behind religion and all of creation. It is said,
everything begins with a thought and one thing humans are good at and
that is giving thought to a problem.

Richard.

> Why does there have to be a force outside or inside of ourselves?
>
> Suppose that this force that you speak of IS US?
>
> Dominick
>

Dear Dominick;

You and I fully agree in this aspect. We are one with the universe and
the universe is one with us. However I do believe there are levels of
consciousness prohibiting us from obtaining this oneness and because of
this ignorance, disparagement of all humanity has resulted.

Richard

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dominick A. Versetto [mailto:dominick@...]
> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 8:18 AM
> To: GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [GnosticThought] Re: An open invitation
>
> Hi George,
>
> The difference is that having the force within ourselves implies that
> we are vessels for the force. I'm suggesting that there is no
> difference between what we are and the force itself.
>
> I'm suggesting that maybe there is no mind/body, spiritual/physical,
> body/soul dichotomy. I think there is a possibility that our
> perception of being disconnected from other parts of the universe is
> an illusion. It may just be that we are each a conscious part of a
> greater whole. We need the misperception of individuality to make
> this life meaningful. Actually, we all, collectively, may be one
> consciousness.
>
> I suppose we would still need to act as if the perception was
> reality. Otherwise there would be no game.
>
> Dominick
>

We can say about Science that it has to be  provable  if it is to be called
Science.  What was called mystical or magical religions  based upon what
appeared as superstition in the past,  can nowadays  often be proven
according to 'Science",  as well as mathematically.  I think it was the
Church which separated Science from religion.  It is as you mentioned that
it seems to be our perceptions and levels of consciousness which prevents
greater knowledge and understanding.

Jenny


----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Pouncy" <rpouncy@...>
To: <GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2003 6:23 PM
Subject: RE: [GnosticThought] Re: An open invitation


> Dear George;
>
> In general, I would agree with your assessment however religion has also
> become the most common source of oppression and reason for hatred.
> Unlike mathematic which can be proven or disprove based upon research,
> religion is based upon consensus or opinions.
>
> Richard.
>
> >
> > Hi Richard,
> > I view religion as a necessary step in the process of waking up.
> >
> > George
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this list send a message to:
GnosticThought-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>

--- In GnosticThought@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Pouncy"
<rpouncy@s...> wrote:
> Dear George;
>
> In general, I would agree with your assessment however religion has
also
> become the most common source of oppression and reason for hatred.
> Unlike mathematic which can be proven or disprove based upon
research,
> religion is based upon consensus or opinions.
>
> Richard.

Hi Richard,

First off I think religion is based on Gnosis. The problem is
misunderstanding someone's Gnosis as dogma by faith.

But is it a problem? Are the things you list as bad about religion
simply necessary steps in our awakening?

George