Anyone have advice on a sow that has a limp on back leg...possibly
from getting caught  in rope this fall? Also anyway short of a vet
test to know if they are pregant? i see marks on both my sows back
from mounting... first season for me and them.
Phillip

On Dec 28, 2007 2:13 PM, Walter Jeffries <walterj@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> We're in the tiny cottage! We moved in Christmas Eve. In prep for
>  moving in we finally stripped the form work off of the master bedroom
>  ceiling. See here:
>
>  http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/2007/12/master-bedroom-inlayed-ceiling.html
>
>  Not FC but still fun - chips of granite inlaid on the under side of
>  the white concrete ceiling.
>
>  My current project, which I should finish the concrete for today, is
>  our bathtub/shower/jacuzzi which _is_ ferrocement. Basically we're
>  building a boat inside out in the house. :)
>
>  Cheers,
>
>  Walter Jeffries
>  Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
>  Orange, Vermont
>  Pastured Pigs & Sheep
>  http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
>  http://HollyGraphicArt.com
>



--
Phillip A. Heinz
802-522-7065

On Jan 15, 2008, at 11:30 AM, goodsell wrote:
> Reminder: Comments due before Jan 28, 2008
> USDA PROPOSES NATURALLY RAISED MARKETING CLAIM STANDARD

Please do go and make comments. It is to be noted that even though
the comment period has not ended and even though the rule is not
implemented and even though the standard is voluntary and even though
there is a long established private Certified Naturally Grown (CNG)
program (http://NaturallyGrown.org) the USDA has ALREADY begun
rejecting labels with the CNG label or Naturally Grown on them.

I ran in to this in the late fall when we applied for approval on the
design of our pastured pork hot dog label. This is a change in policy
because our older labels had been previously approved with the CNG
logo and the the words "Certified Naturally Grown" on them. Go read
all about this here:

http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/2008/01/usda-steals-cng.html

Please do go and comment to the USDA about what you think of them
diluting the term Naturally Grown. The USDA's definition merely deals
with feed, not with how the animals were raised (e.g., on pasture)
which is part of the existing CNG standard. Once again the USDA is
stealing a long established term, just like they did with Organic
years ago, so that the big producers can easily use it and small
producers will be locked out.

Here is a direct link to the USDA entry in the federal register for
leaving comments on the issue:

http://www.regulations.gov/fdmspublic/component/main?
main=DocketDetail&d=AMS-LS-07-0131

If your mailing program chops the line, copy, paste and fix it. That
link is also in the article above so you can get it that way if no
other way.

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://BlackLightning.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Hey all,

I'm going to the Farm Show on Tuesday next, January 29th. I plan on passing
out updated NAIS information. Anyone interested in joining me? It would be
fun to meet up. I think I'll be getting there around 10 am. Let me know.

Sharon
--
Still in the dark about the draconian National Animal Identification System?
Nonais.org
henwhisperer.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Also happening soon just up the road on Saturday, January 26th is the
Winterfest open house at the New England Culinary Institute from 10
am - 1 pm in Montpelier at the Vermont College Campus where NECI is
showing off its stuff. They will be roasting a pig of ours and we'll
be there.

http://neci.edu/winterfest

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://BlackLightning.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

We should have about $1000 to spend after our income tax refund arrives. We
would like to use it for something to help us become more self sufficient and/or
off grid but we're not exactly sure what a good first step is.  Anyone have any
suggestions given this information.

   1. We have a 1500sf old farmhouse in rural Vermont.
   2. My husband is partially disabled so we don't have all the *muscle* we might
need for a labor intensive job.
   3. We have two acres that are mostly wooded and hilly.
   4. We have a small flock of ducks, geese, chickens for eggs. We use them
ourselves & sell them as well. Our coops are at maximum capacity so more birds
would require more coops.
   5. We have a small garden but no way to rototill it this year if we have
another one.
   6. We have pear, persimmon, blueberry, raspberry, blackberry, wineberry,
rhubarb, strawberry and in a few years plums growing on our property.
   7. We have a slowly growing herb garden - mostly culinary although a few semi
medicinal as well.
   8. We have a woodstove to heat with although mostly we use the furnace (oil).
   9. We don't get much sun especially in the winter although I am really
interested in solar if it's at all feasible here and could be done in a cost
effective (cheap) way.
   10. No water source.
   11. No zoning for a wind turbine.
   12. Our hot water heater & stove are gas powered.  All else is electric.
Furnace is oil.
   13. We are very limited in funds to put toward this & have only about $1000.
   14. My goal is to reduce our expenses as much as possible so that we can
eventually work from home and support ourselves that way. Currently we have a
few small online businesses that help but do not support us so I work part time
as well.

   So any thoughts or suggestions greatly appreciated!


Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Actually, I do have a thought.  You mentioned that your hubby is
partially disabled.  Please call agricultural voc rehab.  Not only are
they willing to help to make your life easier (grants) but they will
also help you to brain storm as well.
Here in Vt. there is a REAL push to help women become self sufficient
to some degree in the world of farming.  Give a peek to the  UVM
womens agriculture site... they are amazing.  This is a great time to
look into grants to help supplement that 1000. and do something really
cool around your home !

Mary






--- In VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com, Ellen Christian
<scentednights2002@...> wrote:
>
> We should have about $1000 to spend after our income tax refund
arrives. We would like to use it for something to help us become more
self sufficient and/or off grid but we're not exactly sure what a good
first step is.  Anyone have any suggestions given this information.
>
>   1. We have a 1500sf old farmhouse in rural Vermont.
>   2. My husband is partially disabled so we don't have all the
*muscle* we might need for a labor intensive job.
>   3. We have two acres that are mostly wooded and hilly.
>   4. We have a small flock of ducks, geese, chickens for eggs. We
use them ourselves & sell them as well. Our coops are at maximum
capacity so more birds would require more coops.
>   5. We have a small garden but no way to rototill it this year if
we have another one.
>   6. We have pear, persimmon, blueberry, raspberry, blackberry,
wineberry, rhubarb, strawberry and in a few years plums growing on our
property.
>   7. We have a slowly growing herb garden - mostly culinary although
a few semi medicinal as well.
>   8. We have a woodstove to heat with although mostly we use the
furnace (oil).
>   9. We don't get much sun especially in the winter although I am
really interested in solar if it's at all feasible here and could be
done in a cost effective (cheap) way.
>   10. No water source.
>   11. No zoning for a wind turbine.
>   12. Our hot water heater & stove are gas powered.  All else is
electric. Furnace is oil.
>   13. We are very limited in funds to put toward this & have only
about $1000.
>   14. My goal is to reduce our expenses as much as possible so that
we can eventually work from home and support ourselves that way.
Currently we have a few small online businesses that help but do not
support us so I work part time as well.
>
>   So any thoughts or suggestions greatly appreciated!
>
>
> Ellen Christian >^..^<
>   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
>   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
>   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
>   Got books?
>   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

I just want to caution you about grants, USDA/UVM involvement in your quest
for self-sufficiency. Since you have chickens, what USDA wants to be a part
of the "National Herd", just be careful that you do not end up having to
participate in National Animal Identification System.

Now, my suggestion if you can't till your garden this year. Why not get two
piglets, let them till your garden and then put them in the freezer later?
Just a thought.

Sharon

>  Re: What's a good first step?
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VermontHomesteaders/message/2845;_ylc=X3oDMTJxb24\
2ZzMwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzQ3NjM3NTMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQ0NTI4BG1zZ0lkAzI4NDU\
Ec2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Ztc2cEc3RpbWUDMTIwMjkxNzA5NQ--> Posted
> by: "cabininthewoodsvt" halliganvt@...
> <halliganvt@...?Subject=+Re%3A%20What%27s%20a%20good%20first%20step%3F> 
cabininthewoodsvt
> <http://profiles.yahoo.com/cabininthewoodsvt>  Tue Feb 12, 2008 9:31 pm
> (PST)  Actually, I do have a thought. You mentioned that your hubby is
> partially disabled. Please call agricultural voc rehab. Not only are
> they willing to help to make your life easier (grants) but they will
> also help you to brain storm as well.
> Here in Vt. there is a REAL push to help women become self sufficient
> to some degree in the world of farming. Give a peek to the UVM
> womens agriculture site... they are amazing. This is a great time to
> look into grants to help supplement that 1000. and do something really
> cool around your home !
>
> Mary
>
> --- In
VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com<VermontHomesteaders%40yahoogroups.com>,
> Ellen Christian
> <scentednights2002@...> wrote:
> >
> > We should have about $1000 to spend after our income tax refund
> arrives. We would like to use it for something to help us become more
> self sufficient and/or off grid but we're not exactly sure what a good
> first step is. Anyone have any suggestions given this information.
> >
> > 1. We have a 1500sf old farmhouse in rural Vermont.
> > 2. My husband is partially disabled so we don't have all the
> *muscle* we might need for a labor intensive job.
> > 3. We have two acres that are mostly wooded and hilly.
> > 4. We have a small flock of ducks, geese, chickens for eggs. We
> use them ourselves & sell them as well. Our coops are at maximum
> capacity so more birds would require more coops.
> > 5. We have a small garden but no way to rototill it this year if
> we have another one.
> > 6. We have pear, persimmon, blueberry, raspberry, blackberry,
> wineberry, rhubarb, strawberry and in a few years plums growing on our
> property.
> > 7. We have a slowly growing herb garden - mostly culinary although
> a few semi medicinal as well.
> > 8. We have a woodstove to heat with although mostly we use the
> furnace (oil).
> > 9. We don't get much sun especially in the winter although I am
> really interested in solar if it's at all feasible here and could be
> done in a cost effective (cheap) way.
> > 10. No water source.
> > 11. No zoning for a wind turbine.
> > 12. Our hot water heater & stove are gas powered. All else is
> electric. Furnace is oil.
> > 13. We are very limited in funds to put toward this & have only
> about $1000.
> > 14. My goal is to reduce our expenses as much as possible so that
> we can eventually work from home and support ourselves that way.
> Currently we have a few small online businesses that help but do not
> support us so I work part time as well.
> >
> > So any thoughts or suggestions greatly appreciated!
> >
> >
> > Ellen Christian >^..^<
> > Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
> > Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
> > http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
> > Got books?
> > http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>   Back to top <#11813723b50b8827_toc>
>  Reply to sender
> <halliganvt@...?Subject=Re%3A%20What%27s%20a%20good%20first%20step%3F>|
Reply
> to group
>
<VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com?Subject=+Re%3A%20What%27s%20a%20good%20firs\
t%20step%3F>| Reply
> via web post
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VermontHomesteaders/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJxNmsxYnNhBF9\
TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzQ3NjM3NTMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQ0NTI4BG1zZ0lkAzI4NDUEc2VjA2R\
tc2cEc2xrA3JwbHkEc3RpbWUDMTIwMjkxNzA5NQ--?act=reply&messageNum=2845>
>  Messages in this topic
>
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VermontHomesteaders/message/2844;_ylc=X3oDMTM1MDc\
4aDBrBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzQ3NjM3NTMEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDQ0NTI4BG1zZ0lkAzI4NDU\
Ec2VjA2Rtc2cEc2xrA3Z0cGMEc3RpbWUDMTIwMjkxNzA5NQR0cGNJZAMyODQ0>(2)
>


henwhisperer.blogspot.com


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Ellen,

Where in Vermont are you located? I am in Strafford.
"no water source"--do you mean for hydro? presumably you have a well.
"not much sun"--can you be more specific? Orientation, shading, etc?
"no way to rototill it"--because no rototiller? neighbors? rental?
How insulated/tight is your farmhouse?
What are your biggest expenses?
If solar is at all possible for you, I believe solar hot water is the
most cost effective first step.
What do use your electricity for?
You also might consider building a Rocket stove--much more efficient
than a wood stove (uses less wood and makes less pollution). See
http://www.cobcottage.com/node/214

Peter

Ellen Christian wrote:
>
> We should have about $1000 to spend after our income tax refund
> arrives. We would like to use it for something to help us become more
> self sufficient and/or off grid but we're not exactly sure what a good
> first step is. Anyone have any suggestions given this information.
>
> 1. We have a 1500sf old farmhouse in rural Vermont.
> 2. My husband is partially disabled so we don't have all the *muscle*
> we might need for a labor intensive job.
> 3. We have two acres that are mostly wooded and hilly.
> 4. We have a small flock of ducks, geese, chickens for eggs. We use
> them ourselves & sell them as well. Our coops are at maximum capacity
> so more birds would require more coops.
> 5. We have a small garden but no way to rototill it this year if we
> have another one.
> 6. We have pear, persimmon, blueberry, raspberry, blackberry,
> wineberry, rhubarb, strawberry and in a few years plums growing on our
> property.
> 7. We have a slowly growing herb garden - mostly culinary although a
> few semi medicinal as well.
> 8. We have a woodstove to heat with although mostly we use the furnace
> (oil).
> 9. We don't get much sun especially in the winter although I am really
> interested in solar if it's at all feasible here and could be done in
> a cost effective (cheap) way.
> 10. No water source.
> 11. No zoning for a wind turbine.
> 12. Our hot water heater & stove are gas powered. All else is
> electric. Furnace is oil.
> 13. We are very limited in funds to put toward this & have only about
> $1000.
> 14. My goal is to reduce our expenses as much as possible so that we
> can eventually work from home and support ourselves that way.
> Currently we have a few small online businesses that help but do not
> support us so I work part time as well.
>
> So any thoughts or suggestions greatly appreciated!
>
> Ellen Christian >^..^<
> Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
> Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
> http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
> <http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com>
> Got books?
> http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585
> <http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>

Hi - We are in Castleton (Rutland County).  Yes, by no water source, I mean no
stream, etc for hydro. We do have a very good well.

   Our house faces to the south. To the north there is a large hill with trees,
to the west there are large trees.  To the south is about 50 to 60 feet of
clearing (includes road) before you get to large trees. There is an open area
that is southeast for about 100 feet. The east is relatively clear for about 70
feet or so. The problem is that during the summer when the leaves are out, the
trees are quite tall & that doesn't give us much sun. We do have some but I've
always been told VT is not great for solar since we don't get a lot of days of
sunshine.

   We have no rototiller. My husband and I have  very bad backs and are not up to
digging it ourselves. I'm hoping to find someone willing to let us borrow one.

   We probably need more insulation for the house as well as weatherstripping. We
are supposed to be getting one of those free energy audits from BROC in the next
month or so and will know more.

   I'd say biggest expenses would be fuel oil for the furnace. I'd like to switch
totally to heating with our woodstove next year but an concerned about pipes
freezing in the basement with no heat down there. Propane (stove/hot water) is
$89/mo.  Electric is $59/mo. Then of course we have insurance, etc. that I can't
really do anything about.

   How would I find out if solar hot water is an option for me. I'd hate to
invest in it only to find out that we don't get enough sun for it to work. Also
how does it work in winter when we have days without sun?

   We use electricity for the start for our furnace & stove, refrigerator, chest
freezer, lights (although they are compact flourescent), computers, alarm
clocks, cordless phones, water pump, tv, dvd, vcr, etc.

   Thanks!!


Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Feb 14, 2008, at 7:22 AM, Ellen Christian wrote:
> How would I find out if solar hot water is an option for me. I'd
> hate to invest in it only to find out that we don't get enough sun
> for it to work. Also how does it work in winter when we have days
> without sun?

Ellen,

Solar can be done in very simple ways. During the non-freezing months
it can be as easy as laying a black plastic pipe on the ground or a
roof and passing water through it in the day. See this:

http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/2007/06/hot-cool-natural-pool.html

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://BlackLightning.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Hi Walter,

   That looks really neat. Given that we have no pool, how would it work? I can't
picture miles of black pipe snaking around the house from our well to our faucet
:) Call me very untechnical.


Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Feb 14, 2008, at 8:53 AM, Ellen Christian wrote:
>   That looks really neat. Given that we have no pool, how would it
> work? I can't picture miles of black pipe snaking around the house
> from our well to our faucet :) Call me very untechnical.

The pool is just one application. If you put a 50 gallon water barrel
up in your attic and then connect black plastic pipe from that down
ward by atleast 4' of height to black plastic pipe on a roof, perhaps
a porch, that is in the sun it would thermosiphon to heat the water.

The one caution is you can get very hot water this way. A temperature
limiting valve / mixing valve is a good idea.

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://BlackLightning.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Hmmm - no attic here and no porch :) I'm assuming the water has to be up high?
Could we just put a 50 gallon barrel outside & do it that way?

Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




---------------------------------
Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Feb 14, 2008, at 9:03 AM, Ellen Christian wrote:
> Hmmm - no attic here and no porch :) I'm assuming the water has to
> be up high? Could we just put a 50 gallon barrel outside & do it
> that way?

To do a thermosiphon, which is what I'm thinking of as it is the
least complicated and least expensive, you need 4' of head from the
top of the water in the barrel to the bottom of the loop. More head
gives more cycling. You can simply mount the barrel up off the ground.

Alternatively, a pump on a timer (day only) can be used to drive the
water. You're still collecting free heat for less than the cost of
the electricity.


Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://BlackLightning.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Wow, I'd LOVE to have the propane/electric bills that you have!!  Right now
I am paying $850-900 a month for oil and $180-210 a month in electric.  What
is BROC and how do you get a free energy audit from them?

Thanks,
Susan

-------Original Message-------

From: Ellen Christian
Date: 2/14/2008 7:22:17 AM
To: VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [VermontHomesteaders] What's a good first step?

Hi - We are in Castleton (Rutland County).  Yes, by no water source, I mean
no stream, etc for hydro. We do have a very good well.

   Our house faces to the south. To the north there is a large hill with
trees, to the west there are large trees.  To the south is about 50 to 60
feet of clearing (includes road) before you get to large trees. There is an
open area that is southeast for about 100 feet. The east is relatively clear
for about 70 feet or so. The problem is that during the summer when the
leaves are out, the trees are quite tall & that doesn't give us much sun. We
do have some but I've always been told VT is not great for solar since we
don't get a lot of days of sunshine.

   We have no rototiller. My husband and I have  very bad backs and are not
up to digging it ourselves. I'm hoping to find someone willing to let us
borrow one.

   We probably need more insulation for the house as well as weatherstripping
  We are supposed to be getting one of those free energy audits from BROC in
the next month or so and will know more.

   I'd say biggest expenses would be fuel oil for the furnace. I'd like to
switch totally to heating with our woodstove next year but an concerned
about pipes freezing in the basement with no heat down there. Propane
(stove/hot water) is $89/mo.  Electric is $59/mo. Then of course we have
insurance, etc. that I can't really do anything about.

   How would I find out if solar hot water is an option for me. I'd hate to
invest in it only to find out that we don't get enough sun for it to work.
Also how does it work in winter when we have days without sun?

   We use electricity for the start for our furnace & stove, refrigerator,
chest freezer, lights (although they are compact flourescent), computers,
alarm clocks, cordless phones, water pump, tv, dvd, vcr, etc.

   Thanks!!


Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




---------------------------------
Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Yahoo! Groups Links




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Ellen, I can let you know what we are doing it may or may not be helpful.

Our home does have additional income from my husband. The expenses that the farm
does need to cover are...complete responsibility for all animals including two
horses (yes, a spoiled teenager lives here!), electric created by the barn, all
garden supplies (seeds and tools), the extra electric for our above ground pool,
our homeschooling expenses and any "extra's" (trips to the candy store, movies,
hobbies and what we would consider entertainment) We also expect it to meet most
of our grocery expenses. I spend less then $40.00 a week at the grocery/supply
store for a family of six.)


The first thing is to keep exceptionally good records of what expenses and
incomes. For instance I need keep track of how much my little flock of chickens
brings in and what goes out. We found that it was easy to pay for something, it
was more difficult to say, this chicken is really costing us. Every farm item
has a category

I know that I have to sell about $60.00 of plants or produce to cover the
expenses of planting my garden this year. I need to sell three dozen eggs to
cover the cost of all my chicken expenses. That is what both of those items have
to do in order to continue on this little farm. But in reality they need to do
more. (our cow was the most profitable animal, carrying most of the income.)

Our pigs are an excellent example. We have used scrap wood to build their little
house (three years ago), The fencing we got from freecycle, also three years
ago. The hay for begging and munching is horse hay that the supplier gave to us
because horses cannot eat it. We pick up produce and kitchen waste from the
local grocery store and a couple of restaraunt They are living where our garden
will be this spring, fertilizing it very well. I know that we have a couple of
people that typically purchase some of the meat when butchering time comes
(which we will do ourselves). Oh and the piglets were bartered for, we traded
raw milk this past summer. One and a half pigs will supply our pork needs for a
year.

I also have some pick your own blueberries, raspberries and blackberries. That
have basically no expense. Only a few hours through the year.

We keep our expenses as low as possible. What we do we try to do to the best of
our ability Typically we don't add anything new, until what we are currently
doing, is being done well.

I sell a few crafts here and there. But mostly it is just old fashioned farming
stuff.

My husband and I joke around saying that we should start charging for field
trips, as a historic re-enactment. As we find people are always wanting to stop
by for a visit, but what they really want to do is see what we are up to! I am
starting to think there might be something to the idea.

Now that I have rambled on and on...We have also found that many people seem to
think that the simpler way of life is for the past. Why work so hard on a garden
when you could just go to the store? Why have a solar water heater, it certainly
is more dependable to know that you will have hot water when you want it. It is
a different way of life that we have chosen. The advise we often get is not
realistic or helpful.

If I were you, I would use the resource that you have now. Start amazingly
small. But not invest anything you do not currently have, or at least with very
minimal expense. I would be at every farmers market that you can sell at, at the
very least I would have a small farm stand next to my house.

As far as a rototiller, it may be time to think about raised beds for your
garden. They are much easier to maintain and don't require any tilling. Maybe
this year you can barter for someone to come and till for you. But it is hard to
depend on other people.

I am not sure that any of this was advise, but probably more rambling than
anything else.

Enjoy your farm!
Julie

Want to catch up with what keeps us busy?
www.homesteadblogger.com/benschmountainfarm



Want to catch up with what keeps us busy?
www.homesteadblogger.com/benschmountainfarm

--- Susan <vtmommy78@...> wrote:
> Wow, I'd LOVE to have the propane/electric bills
> that you have!!  Right now
> I am paying $850-900 a month for oil and $180-210 a
> month in electric.  What
> is BROC and how do you get a free energy audit from
> them?

Hi Susan -

BROC stands for Bennington Rutland Opportunity
Council. It helps low income families with a variety
of things. They have a weatherization department that
does free energy audits.

Here is there website:

http://www.broc.org/

Hope that helps,


Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
   Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585





      
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Hi Julie - Thanks for the ideas! We're definitly a
smaller scale than you are :) During the summer the
ducks & chickens eggs pay for themselves between what
we use & what we sell. I want to start selling
hatching eggs for the ducks but not sure how to go
about it.  I had good luck with plants over the summer
last year because quite a few were given to use from
someone who was dividing her garden. I will be
starting some here myself that I hope to sell. We also
sold a few veggies. Since most of my seeds were either
saved or given to me, it covered the cost with no
problem.

Unfortunately I work part time & have to work weekends
so I cannot go to our farmer's market which is
Saturday only. I have a stand out in front of our
house though & will do that again this year.

I will have to start keeping track of expenses because
I didn't last year. That is a great idea ;)

Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Our home
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com/lilac-hill-homestead.htm
   Our business
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585





      
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
Looking for last minute shopping deals?
Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. 
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping

We have a flock of khaki campbell ducks (4 female & 2
male) and I'd like to sell their fertile eggs. They
are wonderful egg producers & out produce our
chickens. They can also be used as meat ducks although
I don't do that.

What would be a good way to go about selling these?
Are there websites our groups or something for this?

Also, we have two geese that were given to us as
babies this past summer - about a month old each. One
is a tolouse and one is an embden (we believe). We
think the embden is a female (that's what we were
told) and the tolouse we have no idea. The tolouse is
very shy and well mannered. The embden is a little
snot. She bites at your hands, legs & feet and hisses
at everyone. She didn't do this over the summer, it
has only been since winter time. My first thought is
that she doesn't like the leather boots & gloves &
hats, etc. that make us look different than we did
over the summer.  She particularly doesn't like me
even though I am the one who lets her in and out every
day & feeds her. She seems to like my hubby who gives
her lots of lettuce in the summer time. She hates both
kids :)

Thoughts to improve her behavior?

Ellen Christian >^..^<
   Our home
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com/lilac-hill-homestead.htm
   Our business
   http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
   Got books?
   http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585





      
________________________________________________________________________________\
____
Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Walter,
A quick question if you don't mind. If someone was to ask you to raise
a pig for them (you supply the piglet from your stock) and deliver it
to their butcher; what would you charge or how might you work that
out. I am just getting into doing this on a small scale to help pay
for the meat I am raising for my family and could use some pointers. I
don't know how to price this out.

Phillip

On Thu, Feb 14, 2008 at 8:09 AM, Walter Jeffries
<walterj@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 14, 2008, at 7:22 AM, Ellen Christian wrote:
>  > How would I find out if solar hot water is an option for me. I'd
>  > hate to invest in it only to find out that we don't get enough sun
>  > for it to work. Also how does it work in winter when we have days
>  > without sun?
>
>  Ellen,
>
>  Solar can be done in very simple ways. During the non-freezing months
>  it can be as easy as laying a black plastic pipe on the ground or a
>  roof and passing water through it in the day. See this:
>
>  http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/2007/06/hot-cool-natural-pool.html
>
>  Cheers,
>
>  Walter Jeffries
>  Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
>  Orange, Vermont
>  Pastured Pigs & Sheep
>  http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
>  http://HollyGraphicArt.com
>  http://BlackLightning.com
>  http://NoNAIS.org
>
>  Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
>  Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
>  Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
>  Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
>  Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads
>
>



--
Phillip A. Heinz
802-522-7065

On Feb 22, 2008, at 3:53 PM, Phillip Heinz wrote:
> Walter,
> A quick question if you don't mind. If someone was to ask you to raise
> a pig for them (you supply the piglet from your stock) and deliver it
> to their butcher; what would you charge or how might you work that
> out. I am just getting into doing this on a small scale to help pay
> for the meat I am raising for my family and could use some pointers. I
> don't know how to price this out.
>
> Phillip


Basically $300 for a six month old pig delivered to the butcher.

Customer pays slaughter, butcher, smoking additionally.

Comes out to about $4.75/lb for a whole pig at about 100 lbs of cuts
+ some other parts.

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Hi

Having become partially disabled myself i surely understand how hard
it is being a home owner. My family and I was contacted by Central
Vermont electric through a program to help cut cost for high end
users. We had to come up with some ideas and they had to approve.
After sending several months they did ok a project where we would add
a small  storage tank to our wood cook stove then to the electric
water heator for winter, some solar panels to the roof and even set up
a pipe system where the sun heats up water in a pipe and it too goes
to the water heater.

According to a retired Vernon Dam engineer friend it is too costly to
add a water generator for electric. Unless u are soo rural that there
is no other way to produce it. A second way of heating water is to put
a 50 gallon barrow on the roof and it would be gravety fed to the
shower. Great for the summer!

I hope that helps a little. Land is just becoming tooo taxed to make
it worth while to live off the land. More of a life style then a
income saver. I hate to think how many acres it would take to grow a
garden, have enough land for wood  to burn and sell for boards and
heat,and small game and  have the income to live too!

--- In VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com, Ellen Christian
<scentednights2002@...> wrote:
>
> We should have about $1000 to spend after our income tax refund
arrives. We would like to use it for something to help us become more
self sufficient and/or off grid but we're not exactly sure what a good
first step is.  Anyone have any suggestions given this information.
>

Hi,  I was contacted by the group from the electric company. They are listed on
the electric bill and probably the university of Vermont can direct you to them.
As far as the black plastic pipe it would not take a lot. Any pool installers
can give free advise. They have to be very careful working on repairs because
the pipes are extremely hot. Also  a pipe system has to be lower then the hot
water tank in order for the heat to get to the tank. Heat travels up.

There is a company out west that makes a cook stove and it comes with a water
pipe heater. i believe u have to either hook up a tank or send it directly to
the hot water tank. There is also a need for a pressure relief valve. I did a
quick check on google to find the stove and it was about 500 dollars.

Community Action will insulate your house if u qualify base on your income. Our
house was done twice. We also took a loan on a double window pane system and it
made a huge difference on our heat savings. We did have to deal with a much
colder house. But the kitchen was nice and warm.

Susan <vtmommy78@...> wrote:                               Wow, I'd LOVE
to have the propane/electric bills that you have!!  Right now
  I am paying $850-900 a month for oil and $180-210 a month in electric.  What
  is BROC and how do you get a free energy audit from them?

  Thanks,
  Susan

  -------Original Message-------

  From: Ellen Christian
  Date: 2/14/2008 7:22:17 AM
  To: VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: Re: [VermontHomesteaders] What's a good first step?

  Hi - We are in Castleton (Rutland County).  Yes, by no water source, I mean
  no stream, etc for hydro. We do have a very good well.

    Our house faces to the south. To the north there is a large hill with
  trees, to the west there are large trees.  To the south is about 50 to 60
  feet of clearing (includes road) before you get to large trees. There is an
  open area that is southeast for about 100 feet. The east is relatively clear
  for about 70 feet or so. The problem is that during the summer when the
  leaves are out, the trees are quite tall & that doesn't give us much sun. We
  do have some but I've always been told VT is not great for solar since we
  don't get a lot of days of sunshine.

    We have no rototiller. My husband and I have  very bad backs and are not
  up to digging it ourselves. I'm hoping to find someone willing to let us
  borrow one.

    We probably need more insulation for the house as well as weatherstripping
   We are supposed to be getting one of those free energy audits from BROC in
  the next month or so and will know more.

    I'd say biggest expenses would be fuel oil for the furnace. I'd like to
  switch totally to heating with our woodstove next year but an concerned
  about pipes freezing in the basement with no heat down there. Propane
  (stove/hot water) is $89/mo.  Electric is $59/mo. Then of course we have
  insurance, etc. that I can't really do anything about.

    How would I find out if solar hot water is an option for me. I'd hate to
  invest in it only to find out that we don't get enough sun for it to work.
  Also how does it work in winter when we have days without sun?

    We use electricity for the start for our furnace & stove, refrigerator,
  chest freezer, lights (although they are compact flourescent), computers,
  alarm clocks, cordless phones, water pump, tv, dvd, vcr, etc.

    Thanks!!


  Ellen Christian >^..^<
    Don't forget Valentine's Day gifts!
    Free bag of country potpourri with every order!
    http://moonlight-creations-jewelry.com
    Got books?
    http://cash4books.net/index.php?ref=54585




  ---------------------------------
  Never miss a thing.   Make Yahoo your homepage.

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




  Yahoo! Groups Links




  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On Feb 29, 2008, at 3:53 AM, Ted Nichols wrote:
> Hi,  I was contacted by the group from the electric company. They
> are listed on the electric bill and probably the university of
> Vermont can direct you to them. As far as the black plastic pipe it
> would not take a lot. Any pool installers can give free advise.
> They have to be very careful working on repairs because the pipes
> are extremely hot. Also  a pipe system has to be lower then the hot
> water tank in order for the heat to get to the tank. Heat travels up.

Not quite. For a passive thermosiphon yes. But I set one up on our
hay shed roof that was higher than our kids' pool. The pool pump,
which is quite small, pumped the water up through the 1" black
plastic water line and through about 300' of pipe until it splashed
back into the pool. It worked great. I would much prefer a
thermosiphon but in that case it was not to be. So an active system
with a pump does the job. Since the pool pump runs anyways this used
no additional energy although the flow was cut in half due to the
head. I also set it on a timer so that it was only on during the day
when the sun was heating the pipes. A further improvement would be a
photo eye to turn it off on dark days.

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

What a great group. I've been lurking for quite awhile & have learned
alot. I rarely have much spare time so prefer to read & learn. I'm
looking to hire somebody knowledgeable in solar power, composting
toilets, earth-sheltered homes/buildings (especially in/on
ledge/bedrock), trees (balsam fir) & living in an environmentally
positive way w/in the laws of Vermont to help me plan how to best use
a small property near Lake Bomoseen in Vermont. My budget is very
limited so I believe I need to find one person who can analyze & plan
as much of everything as possible so as to coordinate work. Any
suggestions &/or offers appreciated. Thank you, Sharon

Hi Sharon,
I am developing  a business ("Telluma nu Kemen", from the Elvish for
"dome under the earth") to do much of that; I'm building my own
earth-sheltered house (on ledge), and have solar, composting toilet,
etc, and want to be able to share what I have learnt. I'm not yet) an
expert however, and don't know much about trees. I do have friends who
can fill in some of the gaps who I can call upon (Walter I'm sure could
also be a great resource).
If you're interested in talking further, email me at tfe@....

All the best
Peter (in Strafford)

sharonjr wrote:

> What a great group. I've been lurking for quite awhile & have learned
> alot. I rarely have much spare time so prefer to read & learn. I'm
> looking to hire somebody knowledgeable in solar power, composting
> toilets, earth-sheltered homes/buildings (especially in/on
> ledge/bedrock), trees (balsam fir) & living in an environmentally
> positive way w/in the laws of Vermont to help me plan how to best use
> a small property near Lake Bomoseen in Vermont. My budget is very
> limited so I believe I need to find one person who can analyze & plan
> as much of everything as possible so as to coordinate work. Any
> suggestions &/or offers appreciated. Thank you, Sharon
>
>

Sharon,

There are many great resources for free information on the web and in
books. You can hire someone to figure everything out but that is the
fun part and it would be quite expensive. As my wife would put it,
better to marry them. :)

Take a peek here:

http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/labels/Tiny%20Cottage.html

to read about how we're building our house. Look in the archives of
this discussion site at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VermontHomesteaders/

For specific things, like say passive solar water heating
thermosiphons, learn to use Google which puts a wealth of information
at your finger tips.

And of course, ask questions and share your experiences here on the
list.

Cheers,

Walter Jeffries
Sugar Mountain Farm LLC
Orange, Vermont
Pastured Pigs & Sheep
http://SugarMtnFarm.com/blog
http://HollyGraphicArt.com
http://NoNAIS.org

Print to pass out: http://NoNAIS.org/handout
Print to hang up: http://NoNAIS.org/poster
Print for people offline: http://NoNAIS.org/printout
Stickers with NoNAISewe Logo: http://NoNAIS.org/stickers
Ad copy is available here: http://NoNAIS.org/ads

Hi Peter,

Thank you for responding & for your suggestions & offer. It seems
other people might be interested in my response (to have a sense of
what has been asked) so I tho't I'd send my reply to the group. If I
do hire you I will certainly correspond privately off list. My budget
is extremely limited so I hope to do all or most of the work myself.
Your experience(s) seem very similar to what I hope to do on a
personal scale (not as a business). At this point I'm not sure what
questions to ask or who to ask to learn what I can legally do, w/o
arousing suspicion & closer scrutiny (by asking the local Zoning
Administrator). It's exciting for me to know that you're building an
earth-sheltered home on ledge; I'm very interested in knowing more
about that, especially whether you're building into the ledge or on
top of it. Please let me know (off-list if you'd prefer) what you
charge & your schedule & availability. Thank you, Sharon

--- In VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com, Peter Payne <tfe@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Sharon,
> I am developing  a business ("Telluma nu Kemen", from the Elvish for
> "dome under the earth") to do much of that; I'm building my own
> earth-sheltered house (on ledge), and have solar, composting toilet,
> etc, and want to be able to share what I have learnt. I'm not yet) an
> expert however, and don't know much about trees. I do have friends who
> can fill in some of the gaps who I can call upon (Walter I'm sure could
> also be a great resource).
> If you're interested in talking further, email me at tfe@...
>
> All the best
> Peter (in Strafford)
>
> sharonjr wrote:
>
<snip>
> > looking to hire somebody knowledgeable in solar power, composting
> > toilets, earth-sheltered homes/buildings (especially in/on
> > ledge/bedrock), trees (balsam fir) & living in an environmentally
> > positive way w/in the laws of Vermont to help me plan how to best use
> > a small property near Lake Bomoseen in Vermont. My budget is very
> > limited so I believe I need to find one person who can analyze &

Hi Sharon,
In terms of email correspondence, phone questions, etc, I'd certainly
not charge you. If it got to site visits, drawing up plans, etc, then
we'd figure something out. I'm just getting started with this aspect of
my business, so it wouldn't be much; it's part of my philosophy in all
that i do that no-one should be unable to get help due to lack of money,
so I always work on a flexible sliding scale. My aim with this is
exactly to help people do what i've been doing.
In terms of legalities, generally Vermont is pretty liberal. All I had
to do to get an occupancy permit was show that I had a good water source
(well) and an acceptable way of disposing of wastes. NO other
requirements. I can build whatever i please. (Of course if I had a
mortgage or house insurance, it'd be a different story). The biggest
hassle was the waste disposal. I wanted to do a reed bed system for the
greywater (Shower, sink, washing machine water) and a composting toilet
for shit--my research indicated that this was about 1/10th the cost and
1/100th as polluting as a regular septic. But my first response from the
town was, "No problem! Of course you can build those! Just as long as
you ALSO build a regular septic system!" Now I did have a perc test done
and had two sites (main and backup) identified as OK septic sites. But I
did NOT want to fork out multi thousands to do this. So I researched and
fought, and won! But this was more because I just got in under the wire
of some regulations which were coming into effect. The State has been
getting ore and more involved in these regulations. When I was
researching, I discovered that, although the actual law says that a
composting toilet and greywater system is OK, the rules promulgated by
the State dept of waste management or whatever it's called specifically
forbid this! I believe this is because of lack of understanding of
current technology; many other states allow and actively encourage these
methods. I don't know how much success you would have trying to get
permission to do this (assuming you want to). One still needs a septic
system engineer to design the system; I found someone willing to do it,
but it was more a question of pointing him at certain web sites and
sources of info and saying, do it like that.
What's your situation in terms of basic substructure, driveway, water,
perc tests, wind and solar exposure, slope, vegetation, streams, etc?
Best
Peter

sharonjr wrote:
>
> Hi Peter,
>
> Thank you for responding & for your suggestions & offer. It seems
> other people might be interested in my response (to have a sense of
> what has been asked) so I tho't I'd send my reply to the group. If I
> do hire you I will certainly correspond privately off list. My budget
> is extremely limited so I hope to do all or most of the work myself.
> Your experience(s) seem very similar to what I hope to do on a
> personal scale (not as a business). At this point I'm not sure what
> questions to ask or who to ask to learn what I can legally do, w/o
> arousing suspicion & closer scrutiny (by asking the local Zoning
> Administrator). It's exciting for me to know that you're building an
> earth-sheltered home on ledge; I'm very interested in knowing more
> about that, especially whether you're building into the ledge or on
> top of it. Please let me know (off-list if you'd prefer) what you
> charge & your schedule & availability. Thank you, Sharon
>
> --- In VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com
> <mailto:VermontHomesteaders%40yahoogroups.com>, Peter Payne <tfe@...>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Sharon,
> > I am developing a business ("Telluma nu Kemen", from the Elvish for
> > "dome under the earth") to do much of that; I'm building my own
> > earth-sheltered house (on ledge), and have solar, composting toilet,
> > etc, and want to be able to share what I have learnt. I'm not yet) an
> > expert however, and don't know much about trees. I do have friends who
> > can fill in some of the gaps who I can call upon (Walter I'm sure could
> > also be a great resource).
> > If you're interested in talking further, email me at tfe@...
> >
> > All the best
> > Peter (in Strafford)
> >
> > sharonjr wrote:
> >
> <snip>
> > > looking to hire somebody knowledgeable in solar power, composting
> > > toilets, earth-sheltered homes/buildings (especially in/on
> > > ledge/bedrock), trees (balsam fir) & living in an environmentally
> > > positive way w/in the laws of Vermont to help me plan how to best use
> > > a small property near Lake Bomoseen in Vermont. My budget is very
> > > limited so I believe I need to find one person who can analyze &
>
>

Walter, thank you for the suggestions & for sharing online so much of
your experiences. I have been accessing your publications for many
months & hope to do some things similar to what you've done. I've
also done alot of online research over the years & have a very good
sense of what I want to do w/ the property but, partly because of its
unique features, believe I need help determining things such as where
best to site a dwelling, which trees must be cut to have adequate
solar, how to legally have the most environmentally benign waste
system(s), if it's economically feasible & wise to have a tree farm
using the 'baby' balsam fir & other trees & which mature trees to keep
for 'parents,' if I have one or more springs, what is the best machine
for maintaining the property (farm tractor, backhoe, ATV, ??) & what I
can do myself & what absolutely must be done by a 'professional?' It
seems to me hiring a person w/ expertise &/or more knowledge than I
have in these areas would be the best way to avoid making costly
mistakes. Also, I'd like be able to occupy the property ASAP & am not
sure the best course to take to accomplish that. Any comments about
any of this would be very appreciated.

As for marrying an adviser: been there, done that, too expensive :-)
Not entirely true; I'd like very much to have a man in my life who
shares my ideas/ideals & is interested in cooperation & sharing.
Altho' not alot of land, it's certainly more than one person needs.
Thank you, Sharon

--- In VermontHomesteaders@yahoogroups.com, Walter Jeffries
<walterj@...> wrote:
>
> Sharon,
>
> There are many great resources for free information on the web and in
> books. You can hire someone to figure everything out but that is the
> fun part and it would be quite expensive. As my wife would put it,
> better to marry them. :)
>
> Take a peek here:
>
> http://sugarmtnfarm.com/blog/labels/Tiny%20Cottage.html
>
> to read about how we're building our house. Look in the archives of
> this discussion site at:
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VermontHomesteaders/
>
> For specific things, like say passive solar water heating
> thermosiphons, learn to use Google which puts a wealth of information
> at your finger tips.
>
> And of course, ask questions and share your experiences here on the
> list.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Walter Jeffries