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#6417 From: paul <roadkyl@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 12:11 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Danger Will Robinson....
iroadkilli
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I can understand why conecting a canary and a 500degree frying pan would
kill the canary but I think the 500 degrees is overkill, just hitting it
with the pan should work.  Never mind I probably need to go to sleep now.

Paul

Jared wrote:

>--
>    I recently learned, the teflon coating (in your frying pan), when
>over heated (500degrees), gives off enough toxic fumes to kill a
>canary on contact,
>

#6418 From: Avery Austringer <avery1415@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 12:26 pm
Subject: Danger Will Robinson......
avery1415
Send Email Send Email
 
>>  or that bronze plus concrete equals an
>> explosion on par with a fragmentation grenade,
>
>Mind shedding a little more light on that one?

It's pretty much been explained, but....

Concrete is hydrated lime.  The "waters of hydration" are held in place
relatively weakly (But taken as a whole, there is a mess of binding
going on.)  When you dump molten bronze onto concrete (or anything else
that's really hot) these waters of hydration let go and turn into
steam.  Steam has 1200 times the volume of liquid water (ignoring
temperature changes - that might contribute another 4 or 5 fold
increase).  While that is happening the bronze, at least the part that
dumped all it's heat into the concrete to make that steam, is
solidifying, so that it can withstand more pressure before it lets go.
Then it lets go....

Pour bronze over dry sand.  A few inches of dry sand over concrete is
probably enough for the volumes that most of us are likely to deal
with.

Now let me tell you about my dad's industrial accident!  Picture a
bucket of molten iron.  This particular bucket held maybe 40 tons of
iron.  Now, imagine the handle (well, one of the lugs the crane hooks
onto) breaking and that bucket getting dumped into concrete lined hole
in the ground.  Amazingly, no one was killed - most of the blast went
up.  But there were plenty of burns to go around.

My dad had been a ways back and, so, helped them load the obviously
injured into an ambulance.  He knew he had some injuries, but didn't
think he was that bad off.  Then he went to wash himself off with some
cold water.  Then his hair fell off.  Pretty much in one piece as he
tells it.

Later the adrenaline wore off.

Another safety tip - wear natural fibers.  His only obvious scaring  is
a band around either wrist where the winter coat he was wearing met
skin.

Avery

#6419 From: "Dawn Perez" <dagperez@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 12:22 pm
Subject: Re: Danger Will Robinson....
dagperez
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My martini shaker isn't that big.  Can we use just 4 parts herald?

Albina, who thinks a dash of vermouth couldn't hurt.

--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "James Winkler"
<jrwinkler@...> wrote:
>
> Ok... "TV" voice...
>
> Take five parts court herald.  Add in one part begging male lover
and one part Pennsic merchant.  Add a dash of scolding parent and a
pinch of bard.  Shake well and serve slightly warmer than room
temperature.
>
> Chas.
>
> ====================================
>
>   What kind of voice is "TV"?
>
>   James Cunningham
>   Too Busy typing to listen to "TV"
>

#6420 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 2:17 pm
Subject: Re: vermouth to the mix
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 
Cutting down to 4 parts herald would make it an "Anchorman"... very similar to a "TV voice" but with more petulance and less real information (basically because the "scolding parent" and "begging lover" parts express themselves more in the mix).  Still, not bad when accompanied by cheese though...
 
A dash of vermouth?  Cool...  it *would* tend to give it some real substance...
 
Winking smiley emoticon
 
Chas.
My martini shaker isn't that big.  Can we use just 4 parts herald?

Albina, who thinks a dash of vermouth couldn't hurt.

#6421 From: helen.schultz@...
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 2:30 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Danger Will Robinson....
meisterin02
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Jared...

I have read this information as well, but you should know that the new electric
frying pans with Teflon do not have a setting any higher than 400 degrees (I
just bought one for my Dad about a week ago).  Now, I don't know if you can get
a frying pan up to 500 degrees on the stove, but at least the industry is aware
of the problem with the electric ones <grin>.

But, you are correct, it is always wise to know about potential problems so that
said problems can be avoided (hopefully).

Meisterin Katarina Helene von Schoenborn, OL
(from sunny California for another 9 days)


  -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Jared" <tudweber_jr@...>
--
    I recently learned, the teflon coating (in your frying pan), when
over heated (500degrees), gives off enough toxic fumes to kill a
canary on contact, this is documentable, canarys are especially
effected by gases, and no person has died from teflon that I know of.
While Im not throwing away my fry pans, it does seem surprising that
this is an approved coating that everyone uses, I typically think of
regulations on such things as being overly stringent.
  It especially puts a perspective on the previous concerns discusion
on food safe finishes and how not to poison your friends. 

  Not trying to feed the hysteria here, just back up what your saying,
with the help of the media and peoples willingness to be paranoid,
were probably freaking out over piddly stuff while ignoring more real
dangers.
        Jared
 
 
  









- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, Avery Austringer <avery1415@...>
wrote:
>
> >Therefore a more constructive tone as some had, of: "Please don't do
> >this, it is extremely dangerous, and here is why" is much better than
> >the reactionary tones of many....
>
>




#6422 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 4:00 pm
Subject: Re: TEFLON... fun findings
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 
Paul... you devil you...  I hadn't heard that one before...
 
WARNING LABEL: HUMOR MODE ON...  (if your personal humor mode switch is malfunctioning please click to the next e-mail.  This is your OSHA approved... or would be if they knew about it, warning...)
 
 
 
Winking smiley emoticon  jeez, I love lookin' junk up... 
 
 
"At 680°F Teflon pans release at least six toxic gases, including two carcinogens, two global pollutants, and MFA, a chemical lethal to humans at low doses. At temperatures that DuPont scientists claim are reached on stovetop drip pans (1000°F), non-stick coatings break down to a chemical warfare agent known as PFIB, and a chemical analog of the WWII nerve gas phosgene."
 
Now... the GOOD NEWS is that according to the chart generic non-stick release more faster... so Teflon still appears to be the toxic non-stick of choice...
 
Then again, one DOES have ask what the heck yer' doing with your frying pans at 680 deg. F...  but hey... accidents happen...  by the way... wonder what is happening to the various greases, etc. in the pan at this point in time?  I'm bettin' the fire alarms in yer' house are going off the hook...  we *do* all have fire alarms in our houses don't we???
 
I'd also note that at at 1,112 deg. F triflouroacetic acid flouride is released... it degrades to octaflurocyclobutane... this is linked to heart palputations!!!   ... and, at 1202 deg. F. Teflon gives of CF4...  a 'global warming gas, affects heart, lungs and nervous sytem'...  personally, 1202 def F affects my nervous system
 
... as a side  note... did ya'll know that the melting point of aluminum is 1220.666 F???   (... and I'm assuming here that we're addressing the Teflon as an installed coating on a pan in actual kitchen conditions and not exploring the behavior of powdered raw Teflon in its industrial pre-application state)...
 
 
 
 
"There is a new focus on abandoned cable removal in order to reduce the fuel load in the workplace. In the U.S.A., there is approximately 8 1/2 million miles of abandoned cable in the workplace. Most of that cable contains Teflon® FEP or Neoflon® FEP (approximately 11 lbs. per thousand feet of plenum cable). This material is potentially highly toxic and extremely corrosive. 500 million lbs. of FEP = a potential super weapon or threat to the U.S. workplace. What staggers the imagination is the fact that none of the testing protocols for communications cable (which is placed in the air systems) measure toxicity or corrosivity (both are extremely significant threats to life and property). The current tests measure fire and smoke but disregard toxic gases."
 
Gulp...  we're friggin' DOOMED!!!   500 MILLION POUNDS of anything, in my mind, would not only make a super weapon... but one hell of a tripping hazard...
 
Makes ya' wonder about what's in the glue on the back of the envelopes ya' lick doesn't it?   Ever wonder why the Post Office got rid of the the 'lick em' stamps and went with the self adhesive type???   What are THEY hiding???
 
... and I'm still wondering why Twinkies have a 'half-life' rather than a 'shelf-life'...
 
HUMOR MODE OFF ... 
 
Now... I didn't find ANYTHING which sez' that any of the above ain't true...  (DARN...)... so... let's accept that the fundimental facts are true... TEFLON at high temps (well, OK... relatively high as compared to a day at the beach, the temp of your average cup of coffee or other things that people would normally experience....) can begin to be associated with things not good for you (like 1000 deg F temps...)... 
 
Now... that being said, let's all agree that OVERLY DISREGARDING safety issues (false heroism) can be as silly on the "I'm impervious" end of the behavior scale as obsessive concern is on the "I'm doomed" end of the behavior scale.  We each need to wear the shoe size that fits us...  and respect the other poor bastards for either being 'foolish heroes' or 'overly timid' as the case might be.
 
Iron will kill you...
Water will kill you...
Pure oxygen highly amplifies fire hazards and can kill you...
and one CAN be killed with kindness
... yet... we need em' all...
 
I'm still not gonna' set my wife's stove on "slag down the family car" and then play with her pots and pans...  even with positive ventilation...
 
Wonder what the MSDS list shows for the toxicology of pine sawdust???
 
Chas.
Knowledge can be dangerous...  a little knowledge can be fatal.

#6423 From: "Haraldr Bassi (yahoogroups)" <yahoo@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 5:44 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: TEFLON... fun findings
haraldrbassi
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On Thu, June 1, 2006 12:00, James Winkler said:
> Paul... you devil you...  I hadn't heard that one before...
>
> WARNING LABEL: HUMOR MODE ON...  (if your personal humor mode switch is
> malfunctioning please click to the next e-mail.  This is your OSHA
> approved... or would be if they knew about it, warning...)

{SNIP}

> Wonder what the MSDS list shows for the toxicology of pine sawdust???

Since you asked:
http://www.pinesolutions.com.au/products/MSDS/downloads/sawdust_nontreated.pdf

Haraldr

--
Dave Calafrancesco

... They got the library at Alexandria, they aren't getting mine!

#6424 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 5:57 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: TEFLON... fun findings
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 

Darn... I was feelin' good about pine...  up to the point where it said that swallowing large quantities of sawdust may cause abdominal pains...  (is 3 board feet of sawdust considered 'a large quantity'... there are times I think I've eaten that much....) and that:

"The finding may also be confined to certain hypersensitive (atopic) individuals who show heightened reactions to other allergens such as pollen. Repeated exposures can produce bronchial asthma and pneumonitis. Sensitised workers should be removed from further exposure to wood dust. WARNING: Inhalation of wood dust by workers in the furniture industry has been related to nasal cancer [ILO Encyclopaedia]. The causative agent or agents have not been identified although certain aldehyde constituents or their quinone oxidation products may perhaps be suspect."

That's it... I'm stickin' with PurpleHeart... if I gotta' go... I wanna' go first class!!!

Winking smiley emoticon

Chas.

(Thanks Haraldr...  good stuff...)

===================================================


On Thu, June 1, 2006 12:00, James Winkler said:
> Paul... you devil you...  I hadn't heard that one before...
>
> WARNING LABEL: HUMOR MODE ON...  (if your personal humor mode switch is
> malfunctioning please click to the next e-mail.  This is your OSHA
> approved... or would be if they knew about it, warning...)

{SNIP}

> Wonder what the MSDS list shows for the toxicology of pine sawdust???

Since you asked:
http://www.pinesolutions.com.au/products/MSDS/downloads/sawdust_nontreated.pdf

Haraldr

--

#6425 From: "Geffrei Maudeleyne" <Geffrei@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 6:23 pm
Subject: RE: [MedievalSawdust] Re: TEFLON... fun findings
geffrei
Send Email Send Email
 

Some of this reminds me of being trained to put plaster casts on broken limbs in the medical field and being told not to eat the plaster.

 

Geffrei

 


From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of James Winkler
Sent: Thursday, June 01, 2006 1:58 PM
To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: TEFLON... fun findings

 

Darn... I was feelin' good about pine...  up to the point where it said that swallowing large quantities of sawdust may cause abdominal pains...  (is 3 board feet of sawdust considered 'a large quantity'... there are times I think I've eaten that much....) and that:

"The finding may also be confined to certain hypersensitive (atopic) individuals who show heightened reactions to other allergens such as pollen. Repeated exposures can produce bronchial asthma and pneumonitis. Sensitised workers should be removed from further exposure to wood dust. WARNING: Inhalation of wood dust by workers in the furniture industry has been related to nasal cancer [ILO Encyclopaedia]. The causative agent or agents have not been identified although certain aldehyde constituents or their quinone oxidation products may perhaps be suspect."

That's it... I'm stickin' with PurpleHeart... if I gotta' go... I wanna' go first class!!!

Winking smiley emoticon

Chas.

(Thanks Haraldr...  good stuff...)

===================================================


On Thu, June 1, 2006 12:00, James Winkler said:
> Paul... you devil you...  I hadn't heard that one before...
>
> WARNING LABEL: HUMOR MODE ON...  (if your personal humor mode switch is
> malfunctioning please click to the next e-mail.  This is your OSHA
> approved... or would be if they knew about it, warning...)

{SNIP}

> Wonder what the MSDS list shows for the toxicology of pine sawdust???

Since you asked:
http://www.pinesolutions.com.au/products/MSDS/downloads/sawdust_nontreated.pdf

Haraldr

--



#6426 From: "Dawn Perez" <dagperez@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 7:07 pm
Subject: Re: vermouth to the mix
dagperez
Send Email Send Email
 
>>  Still, not bad when accompanied by cheese though...

I thought cheese was a given....

Albina

PS thanks for the laughs on this one.  My coworkers think I am even
weirder now! Woohoo!

#6427 From: "msgilliandurham" <msgilliandurham@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 8:26 pm
Subject: Re: TEFLON... fun findings
msgilliandurham
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "James Winkler"
<jrwinkler@...> wrote:
>
> Darn... I was feelin' good about pine...  up to the point where it
said that swallowing large quantities of sawdust may cause abdominal
pains...  (is 3 board feet of sawdust considered 'a large quantity'...
there are times I think I've eaten that much....) and that:
>
> "The finding may also be confined to certain hypersensitive (atopic)
individuals who show heightened reactions to other allergens such as
pollen. [...]

ahHA! I wondered why I'd come home from woodworking class with a sinus
headache and swollen hands... It sure felt like an alergy, but I told
myself, nah, couldn't be... it's only pine!!

Gillian [who does much better with a filer mask and goggles] Durham

#6428 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 9:17 pm
Subject: Re: Wood alergens
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 
On the topic of wood allergens (contact... not inhaled)...  I found a very interesting site:
 
 
Lots of things to review.  Basic assessment 2% - 5% are likely to have/develop contact allergies with wood.  Not a big deal for the 95 -98% who don't... potentially significant to the percentage that does. 
 
Fascinating...   lots of scientific words... link to an on-line dictionary when reading if ya' want the full impact!
 
Tra-la...
Chas.
 
...and, Gillian... glad things are better... thanks to the poster who put up the link for the MSDS list on softwood sawdust... sheesh... I didn't even know it actually existed!!!  Cool...  a breathing filter in the shop ain't a bad idea anyway... the ol' nose hairs can only filter out so much of that stuff...

#6429 From: Conal O'hAirt Jim Hart <baronconal@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 10:42 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Danger Will Robinson....
baronconal
Send Email Send Email
 
isn't 500 degrees a little hot for frying a
canary? What is the smoke point of the oil you
using? You'd probably get a small burnt tasting
crunchy charcoal bit at that temperature, not to
mention the smell of burning feathers....



Baron Conal O'hAirt / Jim Hart

    Aude Aliquid Dignum
      ' Dare Something Worthy '

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#6430 From: "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@...>
Date: Thu Jun 1, 2006 11:25 pm
Subject: breathing while wood-working.. was...
n7bsn
Send Email Send Email
 
--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "msgilliandurham"
<msgilliandurham@...> wrote:
>
..
>
> ahHA! I wondered why I'd come home from woodworking class with a sinus
> headache and swollen hands... It sure felt like an alergy, but I told
> myself, nah, couldn't be... it's only pine!!
>
>

   There are reasons I own on of these
http://www.airwareamerica.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=17

Ralg
AnTir

#6431 From: "Iain Odlin" <i_odlin@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 4:08 am
Subject: RE: Danger Will Robinson....
i_odlin
Send Email Send Email
 
From: "Jared" tudweber_jr@...
>     I recently learned, the teflon coating (in your frying pan), when
>over heated (500degrees), gives off enough toxic fumes to kill a
>canary on contact [...]
>  While Im not throwing away my fry pans, it does seem surprising that
>this is an approved coating that everyone uses

   Common household hairspray will kill a canary, too.

   These things are 'approved' because a canary's reaction is -- rightly so
--
   not the only measuring stick involved.

   -Iain of Malagentia,
    who notes that a canary can drown in a tablespoon of water

#6432 From: "David Stous" <david.stous@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 10:27 am
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] RE: Danger Will Robinson....
chainmaille_...
Send Email Send Email
 
I seem to remember from High School (granted, that was 2 decades ago) that it only takes 3 or 4 TBSP to drown a human!
Dafydd of Verulanium
Shire of Mountain Freehold
East Kingdom
mka
========
David Stous
Chief Maille Smith
Wolf's Den Armoury
www.wolfsdenarmoury.com
  -Iain of Malagentia,
   who notes that a canary can drown in a tablespoon of water

#6433 From: M Descoteau <fantasydesigns2002@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 10:53 am
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] RE: Danger Will Robinson....
fantasydesig...
Send Email Send Email
 
You're right, but most times that 3 or 4 TBSP has to
be in the lungs. <G>

Mike of the Hill
living in the
Kingdom of Trimaris

--- David Stous <david.stous@...> wrote:

> I seem to remember from High School (granted, that
> was 2 decades ago) that it only takes 3 or 4 TBSP to
> drown a human!
> Dafydd of Verulanium
> Shire of Mountain Freehold
> East Kingdom
> mka
> ========
> David Stous
> Chief Maille Smith
> Wolf's Den Armoury
> www.wolfsdenarmoury.com
>     -Iain of Malagentia,
>      who notes that a canary can drown in a
> tablespoon of water


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#6434 From: "Dianne & Greg Stucki" <goofy1@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 2:24 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] RE: Danger Will Robinson....
alisone17404
Send Email Send Email
 
----- Original Message -----
From: "Iain Odlin" <i_odlin@...>
To: <medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, June 02, 2006 12:08 AM
Subject: [MedievalSawdust] RE: Danger Will Robinson....


> From: "Jared" tudweber_jr@...
>>     I recently learned, the teflon coating (in your frying pan), when
>>over heated (500degrees), gives off enough toxic fumes to kill a
>>canary on contact [...]
>>  While Im not throwing away my fry pans, it does seem surprising that
>>this is an approved coating that everyone uses
>
>  Common household hairspray will kill a canary, too.
>
>  These things are 'approved' because a canary's reaction is -- rightly so
> --
>  not the only measuring stick involved.

Not the only one, no, but a bird's respiratory system is considerable more
sensitive than a human's, and if something is harmful to them, it behooves
us to look into what it might be doing, more subtly, to us.

It is commonly accepted now that teflon pans are not a good thing to have in
a household where pet birds live.

I cherish my parrots. Do I still use my teflon pans? Yes, although I am
gradually upgrading to better quality. And I never, never burn anything in
them. A little knowledge is a good thing, IF it is combined with a little
common sense.

Laurensa

#6435 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 4:14 pm
Subject: Lions and tigers and bears... OH MY!!!
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 
[HUMOR MODE: on]
 
Ya' know... the fun thing about the 'teflon pan' thing is that in the modern house... its probably the LOWEST source of any potential toxin that might be floating around...
 
For example:
 
Insecticides
Pesticides
Construction materials out gassing (formaldehyde is fairly common) 
New car smell??   Hey, hey, hey...   vinal breakdown and out gassing... NOT GOOD...
Plastics giving off gasses
Carpets giving off gasses
Cleaning chemicals
Food additives
Living in an electro-magnetic cage
Junk mail (stress)
Darn near anything on TV  (see: herald cocktail)
Propane, methane, carbon monoxide, dioxide and some-other-oxide...
then... let's take a look at allergens and pathogens
Highways, byways and skyways
Muggers, buggers and thieves...
Scratch and sniff ads
Internet viruses and hoaxes
Bad tools
Good tools sharpened badly
Global warming/cooling
The price of a stamp
The fattening of America
Cow out-gassing (see: Global warming/cooling)
Mad Cow... or just pissed-off cow disease
Antibiotics are killing our immune system and making stronger bugs
Aliens
Pseudo-Aliens
... your neighbors!!!!
 
Fact... the world is dangerous...
Fact... the world has ALWAYS been dangerous...
Fact... the world will never be any safer...  because that's how the world works...
 
FOLKS...  the world is a dangerous place... removing one little thing from your universe will not alter it in any meaningful way.  What we need to do is focus on is the big obvious "ITS GONNA' CUT YER HANDS OFF AND LAY WASTE TO YOUR ESTATES" problems...  the little ones are nice... they're interesting... they make great small talk at cocktail parties...  but ya' know... that killer asteroid that will inevitably hit earth some day ain't really on my radar screen.... and if Yellowstone: The Super Volcano goes off... well... I figure we're all pretty much screwed anyway.
 
Teflon is an ant... do not be distracted by ants...  there are elephants loose.  If you take care of the elephants the ants will take care of themselves...
 
95% of all resources are spent on the last 5% of benefit.
 
No matter where ya' go... there ya' are...
 
Obey your thirst...
 
There's this fascinating little thing called the "Law if Unanticipated Consequences":
 

Unintended consequences, or situations where the final outcome is unexpected, can be classed into roughly three groups:

  • positive, usually referred to as serendipity or a windfall
  • a source of problems, according to Murphy's law
  • definitively negative or a perverse effect, which is the opposite result to the one intended

The Law of Unintended Consequences holds that almost all human actions have at least one unintended consequence. In other words, each cause has more than one effect, including unforeseen effects. The idea dates to the Scottish Enlightenment, which influenced people such as Thomas Jefferson.

The Law of Unintended Consequences rules everything... it IS the unifying theory of all...

... so... ya'll just do your best.  With any luck we'll all survive until tomorrow...

[HUMOR MODE: off]

 

So... whattcha' think?  Is there any real potential for me to evolve to become Dennis Leary????

 

Have nice and safe day...         Chas.

 

 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

#6436 From: "william kempin" <NArcher64@...>
Date: Fri Jun 2, 2006 11:04 pm
Subject: Re: Lions and tigers and bears... OH MY!!!
hobbitarcher
Send Email Send Email
 
am I confused, is the the woodworking site. how is teflon in any way
related to woodworking. maybe we could get back to the subject.
Will
--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "James Winkler"
<jrwinkler@...> wrote:
>
> [HUMOR MODE: on]
>
> Ya' know... the fun thing about the 'teflon pan' thing is that in
the modern house... its probably the LOWEST source of any potential
toxin that might be floating around...
>
> For examp

#6437 From: "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@...>
Date: Sun Jun 4, 2006 4:20 pm
Subject: Carts...Re: Greetings from the new guy!
n7bsn
Send Email Send Email
 
Alexandros, at June Fair yesterday I saw at least three different
carts, all looked great.

(side note Matush's bucket coopering demo was well received)

TTFN
Ralg
AnTir

#6438 From: "James Winkler" <jrwinkler@...>
Date: Sun Jun 4, 2006 6:13 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Lions and tigers and bears... OH MY!!!
rivendalehall
Send Email Send Email
 
Teflon shows up on some saw blades... saw blades get hot... could kill the shop canary... 
 
Not sure if that's it... but it sounds good...
 
Chas.
 
(Then again... 'teflon' is just a sacrificial anode in the topic of determination reasonable thresholds of concerns and data validation procedures when discussing technical issues.)
 

am I confused, is the the woodworking site. how is teflon in any way
related to woodworking. maybe we could get back to the subject.
Will

#6439 From: "Dan Baker" <LordRhys@...>
Date: Sun Jun 4, 2006 8:27 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Greetings from the new guy!
captainrhys
Send Email Send Email
 
Actually thats site is down.  Master Avery and I did a class at pennsic one year on cart building, his plans and my breakdown version are available on my site.

http://www.noonelike.us/~rhys/

-Rhys

On 5/20/06, Jared <tudweber_jr@...> wrote:
---
  Avery did a great job explaining the construction of his cart, with
great photos, I think you can still veiw it by going to atlantia arts
and sciences pages, and looking under woodworking-wheeled vehicles.


In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "pdm68wa" <pdm68wa@...> wrote:
>
>    Hello, I am Alexandros Khristodoulopoulos of AN-TIR.
> I joined this group in hopes of finding fine craftsmen and artisians.
> Which I am very pleased that I have found. I was hoping to find plans
> for a cart much like the one Malcolmhawk has made. Please let me know
> if this is possible. Id be willing to pay for the plans. Thanks to all
> and have a great day!
>






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#6440 From: "Jared" <tudweber_jr@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 4:26 am
Subject: Re: Greetings from the new guy!
tudweber_jr
Send Email Send Email
 
--- Following that post, and the later tremendous advice about links,
I posted the link on our links list! (should have done that in the
first place) for Averys pennsic cart.  The former sites are indeed
down, but it is cached at another site where it can be viewed.
       Jared






In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Dan Baker" <LordRhys@...> wrote:
>
> Actually thats site is down.  Master Avery and I did a class at
pennsic one year on cart building, his plans and my breakdown version
are available on
> my site.
>
> http://www.noonelike.us/~rhys/
>
> -Rhys
>
> On 5/20/06, Jared <tudweber_jr@...> wrote:
> >
> > ---
> >   Avery did a great job explaining the construction of his cart, with
> > great photos, I think you can still veiw it by going to atlantia arts
> > and sciences pages, and looking under woodworking-wheeled vehicles.
> >
> >
> > In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "pdm68wa" <pdm68wa@> wrote:
> > >
> > >    Hello, I am Alexandros Khristodoulopoulos of AN-TIR.
> > > I joined this group in hopes of finding fine craftsmen and
artisians.
> > > Which I am very pleased that I have found. I was hoping to find
plans
> > > for a cart much like the one Malcolmhawk has made. Please let me
know
> > > if this is possible. Id be willing to pay for the plans. Thanks
to all
> > > and have a great day!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> ()xxxx[]::::::::::::::::::>
>

#6441 From: "msgilliandurham" <msgilliandurham@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 2:15 pm
Subject: Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls? WAS: Wooden drinking vessels
msgilliandurham
Send Email Send Email
 
Master Will -- greetings! I'm hoping your event went well, and that
you have recovered?

Could you please post these pictures for the edification of us all?

Also -- (OT) Whilst I was perusing the Mary Rose website this
weekend, I saw mention of a "braiser" -- I think it was found in the
Surgeon-barber's things -- but no picture. If you by any chance, have
pictures of that, could you post them as well, please?

Thanking you in advance -- Gillian Durham


--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Bill McNutt" <mcnutt@...>
wrote:
>
> Remind me Monday; I'm cooking feast for 104 this weekend, and
> sawdust and wood research are the last things on my mind.  But I do
> still have those images and will be glad to make them available to
> you.  It's all stave-built mugs and flagons, though, I think.
>
> Will
    _____
>
> From: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
msgilliandurham
> Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 9:14 AM
> To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [MedievalSawdust] Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs,
pls? WAS:
> Wooden drinking vessels
>
>
>
> --- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph Lindberg" <n7bsn@>
> wrote:
> > Now this ratio is not true of the coopered/stave built mugs.
There it
> > is common for the vessel to be taller then it is wide.
>
> Aha! Thank you!
>
> I did a search for the word "Stave" on this list, and found a
> discussion of stave build mugs around March 24 of last year. In msg
> 4068 Master Will gave the URL for some pix he took of mugs from the
> Mary Rose, but the URL no longer works, and I can't find the pix in
> the Files or Photos sections of this group, or on his website.
>
> Master Will, are those pix still available anywhere, please?
>
> Thanks, Gillian Durham
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS
>
>
> Medieval
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/gads?
t=ms&k=Medieval+and+renaissance+costume&w1=Med
>
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>
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t=ms&k=Medieval+time+dinner+and+tournament&w1=
>
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>
>
>
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>
> YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
>
>
>
> *  Visit your group "medievalsawdust
> <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/medievalsawdust> " on the web.
>
> *  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
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#6442 From: "Bruce S. R. Lee" <bsrlee2@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 2:56 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls? WAS: Wooden drinking vessels
bsrlee
Send Email Send Email
 
I think you are referring to a brazier - a portable fire pot for
heating things, such as pots of ingredients for ointments, as well as
being handy for re-heating a late night snack.

regards
Brusi of Orkney
Rowany/Lochac


At 12:15 AM 6/06/2006, you wrote:
>Master Will -- greetings! I'm hoping your event went well, and that
>you have recovered?
>
>Could you please post these pictures for the edification of us all?
>
>Also -- (OT) Whilst I was perusing the Mary Rose website this
>weekend, I saw mention of a "braiser" -- I think it was found in the
>Surgeon-barber's things -- but no picture. If you by any chance, have
>pictures of that, could you post them as well, please?
>
>Thanking you in advance -- Gillian Durham

#6443 From: "msgilliandurham" <msgilliandurham@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 4:05 pm
Subject: Re: Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls? WAS: Wooden drinking vessels
msgilliandurham
Send Email Send Email
 
Yup, that's it, braizer with a *z* -- on page

http://www.maryrose.org/life/barber1.htm

Now for a description if not a picture...

Thanks -- Gillian Durham


--- In medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com, "Bruce S. R. Lee"
<bsrlee2@...> wrote:
>
> I think you are referring to a brazier - a portable fire pot for
> heating things, such as pots of ingredients for ointments, as well
> as being handy for re-heating a late night snack.
>
> regards
> Brusi of Orkney
> Rowany/Lochac
>
>
> At 12:15 AM 6/06/2006, you wrote:
> >Master Will -- greetings! I'm hoping your event went well, and that
> >you have recovered?
> >
> >Could you please post these pictures for the edification of us all?
> >
> >Also -- (OT) Whilst I was perusing the Mary Rose website this
> >weekend, I saw mention of a "braiser" -- I think it was found in
the
> >Surgeon-barber's things -- but no picture. If you by any chance,
have
> >pictures of that, could you post them as well, please?
> >
> >Thanking you in advance -- Gillian Durham
>

#6444 From: WR <sancoeur@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 4:56 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Re: Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls? WAS: Wooden drinking vessels
sancoeur
Send Email Send Email
 
Gillian;

Per http://www.bartleby.com/61/26/B0462600.html

VARIANT FORMS: also bra·sier
NOUN: 1. A metal pan for holding burning coals or charcoal. 2. A cooking
device consisting of a charcoal or electric heating source over which
food is grilled.
ETYMOLOGY: French brasier, from braise, hot coals. See braise.

One photo (admittedly modern) is available at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Brazier.JPG

See also: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/brazier

For entertainment value, see
http://www.occasionalhell.com/infdevice/detail.php?recordID=Brazier

What I found interesting was that my Google search didn't turn up many
examples of the form of brazier also referred to as "incense burner" -
the shallow pan suspended by three or four chains, often with a lid, and
used most often in religious ceremonies.

Wolf

msgilliandurham wrote:
> Yup, that's it, braizer with a *z* -- on page
>
> http://www.maryrose.org/life/barber1.htm
>
> Now for a description if not a picture...
>
> Thanks -- Gillian Durham

--
Done is what had to be done.

#6445 From: Flemish Lady <wildwoman_54@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 5:41 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls?
wildwoman_54
Send Email Send Email
 
Master William may not be able to answer for a bit.
Last week, his heart gave him (and his lady wife) a
bit of a scare (160 pulse will do that).  He was okay
to go to Kingdom A&S this past weekend.  But today,
he's scheduled to swallow a camera so they can take
detailed pictures of his heart.

And he's scheduled to leave for Lilies on Thursday.

Just FYI.

Marthe Elsbeth, OP, OL
Mama Bird to Lady Catherine

--- msgilliandurham <msgilliandurham@...> wrote:

> Master Will -- greetings! I'm hoping your event went
> well, and that
> you have recovered?
>
> Could you please post these pictures for the
> edification of us all?
>
> Also -- (OT) Whilst I was perusing the Mary Rose
> website this
> weekend, I saw mention of a "braiser" -- I think it
> was found in the
> Surgeon-barber's things -- but no picture. If you by
> any chance, have
> pictures of that, could you post them as well,
> please?
>
> Thanking you in advance -- Gillian Durham


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#6446 From: "Arthur Slaughter" <finnmacart@...>
Date: Mon Jun 5, 2006 7:37 pm
Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls?
dairmot
Send Email Send Email
 
Best wishes to Master Will and hopes that all is well.
THL Finnr

>From: Flemish Lady <wildwoman_54@...>
>Reply-To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
>To: medievalsawdust@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [MedievalSawdust] Att Master Will Pix of Mary Rose mugs, pls?
>Date: Mon, 5 Jun 2006 10:41:29 -0700 (PDT)
>
>Master William may not be able to answer for a bit.
>Last week, his heart gave him (and his lady wife) a
>bit of a scare (160 pulse will do that).  He was okay
>to go to Kingdom A&S this past weekend.  But today,
>he's scheduled to swallow a camera so they can take
>detailed pictures of his heart.
>
>And he's scheduled to leave for Lilies on Thursday.
>
>Just FYI.
>
>Marthe Elsbeth, OP, OL
>Mama Bird to Lady Catherine
>
>--- msgilliandurham <msgilliandurham@...> wrote:
>
> > Master Will -- greetings! I'm hoping your event went
> > well, and that
> > you have recovered?
> >
> > Could you please post these pictures for the
> > edification of us all?
> >
> > Also -- (OT) Whilst I was perusing the Mary Rose
> > website this
> > weekend, I saw mention of a "braiser" -- I think it
> > was found in the
> > Surgeon-barber's things -- but no picture. If you by
> > any chance, have
> > pictures of that, could you post them as well,
> > please?
> >
> > Thanking you in advance -- Gillian Durham
>
>
>__________________________________________________
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>Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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