While Guang is out of town, I want to offer an unsolicited
recommendation.

It bares mentioning:

His site is very informative, creative and flexible in payment formats.

His selections are broad and unique.

I ordered a beeng cha and a kilo of yunnan black.

They were both superb and affordable.

The yunnan black is the best price/quality combination I have found in
6 separate purchases.

Try them out (when he gets back)
http://www.houdeasianart.com

Which yunnan black is this??  I went to the site and they have only the golden
tips, sold out, and a wild harvest black.
I am still looking for that peppery yunnan black that I used to get over 5 years
ago.

Jan Ellis


----- Original Message -----
From: DBlakeRoss
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 10:34:12 AM
Subject: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


While Guang is out of town, I want to offer an unsolicited
recommendation.

It bares mentioning:

His site is very informative, creative and flexible in payment formats.

His selections are broad and unique.

I ordered a beeng cha and a kilo of yunnan black.

They were both superb and affordable.

The yunnan black is the best price/quality combination I have found in
6 separate purchases.

Try them out (when he gets back)
http://www.houdeasianart.com






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Jan

   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me. I expect
that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and restocks.

   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I) favor. That
is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.

   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of pepper. It
is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.

   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no off flavors
and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink while being so smooth. And
it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).



Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
   Which yunnan black is this??  I went to the site and they have only the golden
tips, sold out, and a wild harvest black.
I am still looking for that peppery yunnan black that I used to get over 5 years
ago.

Jan Ellis


----- Original Message -----
From: DBlakeRoss
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 10:34:12 AM
Subject: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


While Guang is out of town, I want to offer an unsolicited
recommendation.

It bares mentioning:

His site is very informative, creative and flexible in payment formats.

His selections are broad and unique.

I ordered a beeng cha and a kilo of yunnan black.

They were both superb and affordable.

The yunnan black is the best price/quality combination I have found in
6 separate purchases.

Try them out (when he gets back)
http://www.houdeasianart.com






                      TEA DISCUSSION MAILING LIST
                    "Under the pavement, the earth."






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

So it must be the golden tips that was shown as sold out.   thank you for
clarifying.

the last time I had a peppery or spicy yunnan was years ago.  I just bought some
gold tips and black gold from yunnan sourcing and they are as you
describe-----mild , fresh tasting and clean drinking, not heavy and peppery. 
Easy to like  and a reasonable price for everyday.  I like them a lot, but
I asked if he could try to find the peppery black of my memory and he sent a
sample, but it isn't what my taste buds remember.
So I continue to search....................

Thanks again,   Jan




----- Original Message -----
From: Blake Ross
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 11:07:58 AM
Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


Hi Jan

   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me. I expect
that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and restocks.

   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I) favor. That
is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.

   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of pepper. It
is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.

   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no off flavors
and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink while being so smooth. And
it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).






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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I have never tried this particular tea, but a local shop in GA sells a
Yunnan Black that is described as having a peppery characteristic.  I did
mention them to Blake the other day, but not recently enough for him to have
tried any.

The link for the tea is
http://www.teafusions.com/component/option,com_wrapper/Itemid,94/

I am not "pushing" this company - I get no monetary profit from you shopping
with them.  They are merely a local shop, which has a great supply and great
customer service.  Any business I throw their way simply keeps a quality tea
room within minutes of where I will soon e living again.

Amy

On 5/1/06, Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
>
> So it must be the golden tips that was shown as sold out.   thank you for
> clarifying.
>
> the last time I had a peppery or spicy yunnan was years ago.  I just
> bought some gold tips and black gold from yunnan sourcing and they are as
> you describe-----mild , fresh tasting and clean drinking, not heavy and
> peppery.  Easy to like  and a reasonable price for everyday.  I like them a
> lot, but
> I asked if he could try to find the peppery black of my memory and he sent
> a sample, but it isn't what my taste buds remember.
> So I continue to search....................
>
> Thanks again,   Jan
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Blake Ross
> To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: 5/1/2006 11:07:58 AM
> Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service
>
>
> Hi Jan
>
>   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me. I
> expect that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and restocks.
>
>   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I) favor.
> That is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.
>
>   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of
> pepper. It is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.
>
>   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no off
> flavors and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink while being so
> smooth. And it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).
>
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

You can try the Superior Yunnan Fancy from Imperial Tea Court.

   They have fine quality but the prices! Yikes! Peppery and rich. Brews like a
heavy cream.

   Depends how desperate you are for that particular flavor.

Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
   So it must be the golden tips that was shown as sold out.   thank you for
clarifying.

the last time I had a peppery or spicy yunnan was years ago.  I just bought some
gold tips and black gold from yunnan sourcing and they are as you
describe-----mild , fresh tasting and clean drinking, not heavy and peppery. 
Easy to like  and a reasonable price for everyday.  I like them a lot, but
I asked if he could try to find the peppery black of my memory and he sent a
sample, but it isn't what my taste buds remember.
So I continue to search....................

Thanks again,   Jan




----- Original Message -----
From: Blake Ross
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 11:07:58 AM
Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


Hi Jan

   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me. I expect
that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and restocks.

   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I) favor. That
is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.

   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of pepper. It
is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.

   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no off flavors
and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink while being so smooth. And
it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).






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In a message dated 5/1/2006 2:51:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
dblakeross@... writes:

You can try the Superior Yunnan Fancy from Imperial Tea Court.

   They have fine quality but the prices! Yikes! Peppery and rich. Brews like
a heavy cream.

   Depends how desperate you are for that particular flavor.
-------------------------------
Isn't it odd how some of us get the peppery and others don't in some teas.
I've been enjoying the ITC Superior Yunnan of late, too, but wasn't finding it a
super peppery one. I begin to wonder if I've forgotten what that quality
really was like in the Yunnan teas of times long past!

Ah yes, the prices...

From somewhat recent notes:

I have posted more often about Imperial Tea Court's Imperial Gold Yunnan. But
I am sampling their less pricey (only comparatively) Superior Yunnan today,
and it's rather a decent tea. Verrry smooth. Aroma pulls up the mocha notes
with a nice maple sweetness and hint of spice. Not up front peppery, but just a
hint of mild spice more in aftertaste, where I also just found--maybe--a
shape-shifting light orchid floral note.This drinks with more thickness than the
'softer' very golden Yunnan teas I've had lately, and it goes beyond the
floral-honey emphasis. It is not a leathery/savory type or smoky Yunnan. Nor is
it
'earth-bound.' It has a very modest hit of earth in the cup against a light
malty
taste. It makes a nicely rounded cup with a smooth delivery. The aroma, as it
cools, really pulls forward in sweetness. This has a very smooth character,
not a rough edge to be seen. This latter quality is something I quite
appreciate in this one.  No, it is not making a dramatic presentation of those
characteristics some of us long to find in Yunnan teas by any means. This is
just a
very easy Yunnan tea to drink and like. Very well-behaved.

---------------
"The Holy Grail!. . . What is it?
The phantom of a cup that comes and goes?"
"Nay, monk, what phantom?" answered Percivale.
     Tennyson
-------------

...maybe not an eyebrow raiser, but I do find myself craving this tea of
late. This morning's pot was showing again a very full and distinct maple
sweetness in aroma along with that floral 'orchid' note. But what I really
noticed
this morning was that the cup itself seemed very malty, and that 'orchid' note
was definitely meandering into the finish. The cup remains very smooth. Not the
mocha and spice type Yunnan experience, but this malty-maple-orchid one is
quite nice, and I especially like the smoothness of the cup as well as that
enticing maple aroma.

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I have heard that IPOT's superior yunnan fancy is very good-----------but I also
find their prices high .   I try to find better than average teas that are still
a good value, and although that tea is within what I spend for a special
occasion tea, it is not what I spend for everyday teas. (I just may break down
and try it though.)  I have found that once I get used to an exceptional tea I
have difficulty with ones within the price range I choose so I have to be
careful not to get used those teas.

I must admit that my budget for teas has been going up as my taste buds become
more 'picky' so who knows what I'll be doing next year.

My other favorite tea is a good keemun (non-smoky) and they also really vary. 
Probably one of my favorites is the keemun Jin Zhen  I got from Zdenek last
year----light and sweet with great complexity.

Or..........my taste buds run to the mocha keemun related teas-----like a good
golden monkey---for winter , which is when I drink the richer yunnans as well..

I guess half the fun is the search, and if the teas end up not being to my
particular taste buds, I aways can find someone who appreciates them.  And look
at all the great  people we meet in the process.

Jan in Portland, who is drinking a golden monkey at the moment---a lighter one.


----- Original Message -----
From: Blake Ross
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 11:49:19 AM
Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


You can try the Superior Yunnan Fancy from Imperial Tea Court.

   They have fine quality but the prices! Yikes! Peppery and rich. Brews like a
heavy cream.

   Depends how desperate you are for that particular flavor.

Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
   So it must be the golden tips that was shown as sold out.   thank you for
clarifying.

the last time I had a peppery or spicy yunnan was years ago.  I just bought some
gold tips and black gold from yunnan sourcing and they are as you
describe-----mild , fresh tasting and clean drinking, not heavy and peppery. 
Easy to like  and a reasonable price for everyday.  I like them a lot, but
I asked if he could try to find the peppery black of my memory and he sent a
sample, but it isn't what my taste buds remember.
So I continue to search....................

Thanks again,   Jan




----- Original Message -----
From: Blake Ross
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/1/2006 11:07:58 AM
Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


Hi Jan

   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me. I expect
that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and restocks.

   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I) favor. That
is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.

   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of pepper. It
is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.

   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no off flavors
and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink while being so smooth. And
it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).






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Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
   I must admit that my budget for teas has been going up as my taste buds become
more 'picky' so who knows what I'll be doing next year.    I have been noticing
that as well.

   Pu'erh is a good example. It took me 2-3 years to notice or even appreciate
the finer qualities of pu'erh.
   Now, I find those flavors indispensible.
   Spending a fortune looking for very specific tastes and qualities of leaf.

   Connoisseur psychology is an interesting subject. On the positive side, when
grounded, I notice the people on this list have refined tastes, notice and
enumerate qualities that most people overlook, and are very demanding of real
quality to production, storage and delivery.

   All in all, finding a very high quality tea at a affordable price is a small
miracle.










[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I know Gerry raised this subject a while ago, sorry apologies if I'm
repeating something:

In my experience a defining characteristic of high-quality Yunnan
Golds (or Gold Tips, or Fancy, or however they're marketed) is staying
power. Sets apart this good from the just okay.

For many of them you can get a great first brew. Or if not great,
decent. Pepper, spicy, and everything mentioned here -- but I like the
ones that offer up caramel and honey and something vanilla. And
drinking a good Yunnan Gold really helps to place another giant piece
of the Chinese tea puzzle -- it's an aha moment in terms of how the
flavor profiles all connect somehow.

But some YGs immediately drop off, a steep curve down, and the second
brew is blah. Or, two brews are good, but the third just pathetic. I
have experienced this again and again. Very few actually hold up over
multiple brews (I have a dedicated Yixing for YG and am always looking
for the endurance ones)-- I think this is particular to the high-end
Yunnan "Golds" -- not just the regular Yunnans that are marketed in
many ways.

The last time I had the tea I had the high-quality, high-priced
version from Imperial Tea Court. And it lasted and lasted. And I
thought that maybe in this case you get what you pay for... Maybe it
was seasonal, though -- can't vouch for the current.

Just my two cents on a favorite tea -- great morning cup. IPoT was
good but dropped off quickly the last time I had it. Don't recall any
of the others as I stopped drinking it after an "intervention" and I
started attending regular sessions of Yunnan Gold Anonymous, also
known as Who Has the Good Raw Pu-erh, Folks?, or Age This, Baby.

Now those meetings. They're fun.

Adrian


--- In tea-disc@yahoogroups.com, "Masaharu Ellis" <masajanellis@...>
wrote:
>
> I have heard that IPOT's superior yunnan fancy is very
good-----------but I also find their prices high .   I try to find
better than average teas that are still a good value, and although
that tea is within what I spend for a special occasion tea, it is not
what I spend for everyday teas. (I just may break down and try it
though.)  I have found that once I get used to an exceptional tea I
have difficulty with ones within the price range I choose so I have to
be careful not to get used those teas.
>
> I must admit that my budget for teas has been going up as my taste
buds become more 'picky' so who knows what I'll be doing next year.
>
> My other favorite tea is a good keemun (non-smoky) and they also
really vary.  Probably one of my favorites is the keemun Jin Zhen  I
got from Zdenek last year----light and sweet with great complexity.
>
> Or..........my taste buds run to the mocha keemun related
teas-----like a good golden monkey---for winter , which is when I
drink the richer yunnans as well..
>
> I guess half the fun is the search, and if the teas end up not being
to my particular taste buds, I aways can find someone who appreciates
them.  And look at all the great  people we meet in the process.
>
> Jan in Portland, who is drinking a golden monkey at the moment---a
lighter one.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Blake Ross
> To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: 5/1/2006 11:49:19 AM
> Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service
>
>
> You can try the Superior Yunnan Fancy from Imperial Tea Court.
>
>   They have fine quality but the prices! Yikes! Peppery and rich.
Brews like a heavy cream.
>
>   Depends how desperate you are for that particular flavor.
>
> Masaharu Ellis <masajanellis@...> wrote:
>   So it must be the golden tips that was shown as sold out.   thank
you for clarifying.
>
> the last time I had a peppery or spicy yunnan was years ago.  I just
bought some gold tips and black gold from yunnan sourcing and they are
as you describe-----mild , fresh tasting and clean drinking, not heavy
and peppery.  Easy to like  and a reasonable price for everyday.  I
like them a lot, but
> I asked if he could try to find the peppery black of my memory and
he sent a sample, but it isn't what my taste buds remember.
> So I continue to search....................
>
> Thanks again,   Jan
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Blake Ross
> To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: 5/1/2006 11:07:58 AM
> Subject: RE: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service
>
>
> Hi Jan
>
>   Yeah, I emailed him on this. He had a bit left and sold it to me.
I expect that he will reposition Yunnan Black when he gets back and
restocks.
>
>   By the way, this is not the peppery yunnan black that you (and I)
favor. That is REALLY hard to find. Tends to have a lot of golden tip IMO.
>
>   This is a smooth Black Yunnan, plenty of golden tips with hints of
pepper. It is not a strong or pronounced element of the flavor.
>
>   This is a crowd pleaser or if you like, mild yunnan. But is has no
off flavors and acceptable complexity to not be a "bore" to drink
while being so smooth. And it was affordable. (I bought 2 lbs!).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>                      TEA DISCUSSION MAILING LIST
>                    "Under the pavement, the earth."
>
>
>
>
>
>
> SPONSORED LINKS Drinking water filter Drinking water test Drinking
water treatment
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>
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I'm just about to vote in the puer-oll.

I realize this is personal, but it is obvious to me which tea is best
and wich is not.

I brewed in my own way -- shared by many here: ~5gr in 100 ml gaiwan,
short & progressively longer steeps -- as well as the way recommended
by Stephane. I found the later interesting -- mostly managed to get
really good aftertaste from the brews, and an amazing visual on the
good tea -- but it did not offer much in the way of a nuanced
understanding of the tea. Seems like you'd had to spend time with the
method, to figure out what to look for etc.

Anyway. Thanks, everyone, for the samples. Someone in Singapore sent a
clear baggie with some leaves but no label -- couldn't tell if I
should smoke it or drink it. I drank it and, boy, is that a good tea.
What was I drinking?

I'm interested to know if others also managed to have strong opinions
about these teas, or found it difficult to decide.

-Adrian (drinking the strong brews from the Stephane method and
getting buzzed from it....

Adrian <lurssen@...> wrote:
   Anyway. Thanks, everyone, for the samples. Someone in Singapore sent a
clear baggie with some leaves but no label -- couldn't tell if I
should smoke it or drink it. I drank it and, boy, is that a good tea.
What was I drinking?


   Ambrosia.

   Second that.

   I had some and it was excellent.
   That was my 2nd place next to Guang's '99 GBT.

Kevin is such a sneak. I am almost positive it is a similar Mao Cha Beeng.





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks to a tea friend sharing ordering/shipping, I've been sitting on a
decent amount (or, indecent, depending on what one feels about Yunnan greed) of
the Yunnan Sourcing LLC Yunnans--the Imperial Gold Tips, the Black Gold Yunnan
(priced slightly under the other one), and the Compressed Black Gold Yunnan.
There is something entirely decadent about emptying a 500 gram bag of golden
tipped Yunnan into lock-down canisters, watching the golden fluff puff into the
air and seemingly vanish. I expect some of it is still clinging to the corners
of the room somewhere. :-)

Has anyone else tried to pinpoint the difference between the two golden
Yunnans offered by Yunnan Sourcing LLC? I've compared them cup to cup a couple
times and am only half-satisfied with my observations.  They really have a
similar
character as I made them today, a creamy body with that more 'fresh' Yunnan
profile that, for me, says maple sap and that light 'orchid' floral note
against a very light and subdued earth. It's possible that the Black Gold,
hereafter
#2, is just a tad more floral and the #1 Imperial Gold tips is just a bit
'creamier' in comparison, though they both have this similar quality. I think
there might be (?) a touch more depth in the aroma of #1, just a bit thicker and
deeper as to aroma. And ah wait...as they're cooling now, the #1 is hanging on
to a slightly deeper and more full aroma and just a tad more creamy. Their
differences, for me, actually come up better as they cool than when hot.

These are both what I think of as a more 'fresh' Yunnan drinking
experience--more focused on maple sap and floral and very light/subdued earth.
Not smoky.
Not savory. Not leathery. Not particularly malty either. Neither goes deeply
into that spicy range that Yunnan can sometimes do (used to do especially in
times long past). Just a more 'youthful' type profile as I think of it, but
pleasantly so--not the 'raw' young character I have encountered a few times. But
also NOT as high in floral and honey as the Golden Bud A from
http://www.pu-erhtea.com/ That was *the* most floral/youthful/honey'd one I'd
ever had.

The differences between these two Yunnan Sourcing LLC Yunnans was a bit
easier to discern (or, at least, to imagine I could discern) as they cooled. It
seems that the #1 hangs onto a slightly more full aroma and creamier body, while
the #2 heads off into just a hint more pungency-floral. Rather the same thing
suggested when they were being drunk hot. But, 'tis a tough call for me to
make.

I wasn't as personally keen on the sample of Fancy Grade Yunnan from this
same source (the one Jan talks about).  Fancy Grade Yunnan/Yunnan Sourcing LLC:
has more smoke/earth to the aroma and less sweet/honey/floral compared to their
Black Gold and Imperial Gold Tips. More 'earthbound' as to flavor, too.
Clean, but mainly an 'earthy' impression, but without the savory character of
the
compressed Yunnan. Some light maple sweetness comes up a bit as tea cools. Not p
eppery or spicy to my own taste impressions. It does have a slightly higher
level of astringency to the cup itself compared to Black Gold and Imperial Gold
Tips. It hovers between what interests me. Doesn't have the softer
mellow-sweetness of the other two, but isn't as aggressive in smoke/savory as
the
compressed Yunnan, which makes this Fancy Grade sort of fall in a limbo zone for
me.
Not enough of what draws me to either ends of the Yunnan spectrum. If I want
the Yunnan to be smoky/savory, then I'd prefer the compressed.

I have been quite enjoying the compressed Black Gold Yunnan from this source,
too. This tea is distinctly sweet in aroma but in a savory-smoky way. It
drinks with a very nice clarity though, which surprised me given the more rustic
aroma. Quite mellow actually (if you don't overdo leaf amount I was warned).
There is something in the taste of this tea that I mentally 'know' but can't put
my finger on immediately. Perhaps it's an earthy bean sprout-y or bamboo-like
taste? Because yes, there's an earthy/ashy note to the tea but very clean
somehow. Bean sprouts? what is it? maybe it is clean ash. Of all the Yunnan teas
I've sampled that have the smoky-savory thing going on, this has to be one of
my favorites. That smoky-savory aftertaste really does linger as does that
'other' flavor note. I always hesitate to use meat references about teas as they
must sound unpalatable to vegetarians or to those with religious scruples in
this regard. But the sweet-savory-smoky note of this tea does, I confess,
remind me just a tad of a hickory smoked bacon. If you are vegetarian or etc.,
please pretend I did not say that! :-)

None of the above are my own personal "Holy Grail Quest Yunnans," but they
are filling in well enough till the quest leads further. In Pursuit of Tea had
my favorite Yunnan until about January of this year when something changed
rather radically--am hoping the pendulum eventually swings back.

I go back now and again to ITC's Imperial Yunnan Gold when it just seems
"necessary" to do so. Whatever was in my canister, the lot before the last one I
purchased, was *amazing.*

Holly H-B






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Love your descriptions -- do you find these teas have differing
staying powers over the longterm...

--- In tea-disc@yahoogroups.com, anodyne@... wrote:
>
> Thanks to a tea friend sharing ordering/shipping, I've been sitting
on a
> decent amount (or, indecent, depending on what one feels about
Yunnan greed) of
> the Yunnan Sourcing LLC Yunnans--the Imperial Gold Tips, the Black
Gold Yunnan
> (priced slightly under the other one), and the Compressed Black Gold
Yunnan.
> There is something entirely decadent about emptying a 500 gram bag
of golden
> tipped Yunnan into lock-down canisters, watching the golden fluff
puff into the
> air and seemingly vanish. I expect some of it is still clinging to
the corners
> of the room somewhere. :-)
>
> Has anyone else tried to pinpoint the difference between the two golden
> Yunnans offered by Yunnan Sourcing LLC? I've compared them cup to
cup a couple
> times and am only half-satisfied with my observations.  They really
have a similar
> character as I made them today, a creamy body with that more 'fresh'
Yunnan
> profile that, for me, says maple sap and that light 'orchid' floral
note
> against a very light and subdued earth. It's possible that the Black
Gold, hereafter
> #2, is just a tad more floral and the #1 Imperial Gold tips is just
a bit
> 'creamier' in comparison, though they both have this similar
quality. I think
> there might be (?) a touch more depth in the aroma of #1, just a bit
thicker and
> deeper as to aroma. And ah wait...as they're cooling now, the #1 is
hanging on
> to a slightly deeper and more full aroma and just a tad more creamy.
Their
> differences, for me, actually come up better as they cool than when hot.
>
> These are both what I think of as a more 'fresh' Yunnan drinking
> experience--more focused on maple sap and floral and very
light/subdued earth. Not smoky.
> Not savory. Not leathery. Not particularly malty either. Neither
goes deeply
> into that spicy range that Yunnan can sometimes do (used to do
especially in
> times long past). Just a more 'youthful' type profile as I think of
it, but
> pleasantly so--not the 'raw' young character I have encountered a
few times. But
> also NOT as high in floral and honey as the Golden Bud A from
> http://www.pu-erhtea.com/ That was *the* most
floral/youthful/honey'd one I'd ever had.
>
> The differences between these two Yunnan Sourcing LLC Yunnans was a bit
> easier to discern (or, at least, to imagine I could discern) as they
cooled. It
> seems that the #1 hangs onto a slightly more full aroma and creamier
body, while
> the #2 heads off into just a hint more pungency-floral. Rather the
same thing
> suggested when they were being drunk hot. But, 'tis a tough call for
me to
> make.
>
> I wasn't as personally keen on the sample of Fancy Grade Yunnan from
this
> same source (the one Jan talks about).  Fancy Grade Yunnan/Yunnan
Sourcing LLC:
> has more smoke/earth to the aroma and less sweet/honey/floral
compared to their
> Black Gold and Imperial Gold Tips. More 'earthbound' as to flavor, too.
> Clean, but mainly an 'earthy' impression, but without the savory
character of the
> compressed Yunnan. Some light maple sweetness comes up a bit as tea
cools. Not p
> eppery or spicy to my own taste impressions. It does have a slightly
higher
> level of astringency to the cup itself compared to Black Gold and
Imperial Gold
> Tips. It hovers between what interests me. Doesn't have the softer
> mellow-sweetness of the other two, but isn't as aggressive in
smoke/savory as the
> compressed Yunnan, which makes this Fancy Grade sort of fall in a
limbo zone for me.
> Not enough of what draws me to either ends of the Yunnan spectrum.
If I want
> the Yunnan to be smoky/savory, then I'd prefer the compressed.
>
> I have been quite enjoying the compressed Black Gold Yunnan from
this source,
> too. This tea is distinctly sweet in aroma but in a savory-smoky
way. It
> drinks with a very nice clarity though, which surprised me given the
more rustic
> aroma. Quite mellow actually (if you don't overdo leaf amount I was
warned).
> There is something in the taste of this tea that I mentally 'know'
but can't put
> my finger on immediately. Perhaps it's an earthy bean sprout-y or
bamboo-like
> taste? Because yes, there's an earthy/ashy note to the tea but very
clean
> somehow. Bean sprouts? what is it? maybe it is clean ash. Of all the
Yunnan teas
> I've sampled that have the smoky-savory thing going on, this has to
be one of
> my favorites. That smoky-savory aftertaste really does linger as
does that
> 'other' flavor note. I always hesitate to use meat references about
teas as they
> must sound unpalatable to vegetarians or to those with religious
scruples in
> this regard. But the sweet-savory-smoky note of this tea does, I
confess,
> remind me just a tad of a hickory smoked bacon. If you are
vegetarian or etc.,
> please pretend I did not say that! :-)
>
> None of the above are my own personal "Holy Grail Quest Yunnans,"
but they
> are filling in well enough till the quest leads further. In Pursuit
of Tea had
> my favorite Yunnan until about January of this year when something
changed
> rather radically--am hoping the pendulum eventually swings back.
>
> I go back now and again to ITC's Imperial Yunnan Gold when it just
seems
> "necessary" to do so. Whatever was in my canister, the lot before
the last one I
> purchased, was *amazing.*
>
> Holly H-B
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

In a message dated 5/1/2006 4:36:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
lurssen@... writes:

do you find these teas have differing
staying powers over the longterm...
---------
Meaning multiple steeps? I confess I don't tend to brew Yunnan this way,
exception being the ITC Imperial Gold. Or, meaning their characters staying
intact
after long-term storage? This is the first Yunnan Sourcing Yunnans I've had,
so if the latter, I just haven't experienced that yet. And at the greedy rate
I drink Yunnan...hmmm...well....

But I am thinking you meant the former based on your previous post. And I
just haven't experimented with these teas in this way. Yet. P'rhaps I should.
It's an interesting question and might be a way to further pinpoint what their
differences are.

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Adrian]
> I'm just about to vote in the puer-oll.

[Kevin]
I would love to read your detailed reviews for these pu-erhs =)

[Adrian]
> Someone in Singapore sent a
> clear baggie with some leaves but no label -- couldn't tell if I
> should smoke it or drink it. I drank it and, boy, is that a good tea.
> What was I drinking?

[Kevin]
It came from Kevin (the "other" Kevin....well, chronologically
speaking I'm the "other" Kevin actually ^^)

By looking at the pictures he uploaded in this yahoo group pic folder;
this beeng cha is Liu Shan (=6 mountains) cake from Purple Cane
Company, a Malaysian company. (Liu chan characters are on bottom left
side of the wrapper). Basing my guess on Purple Cane 2004 six mountain
series, I believe these 6 mountains are Man Sha, Yi Wu, Yi Bang, Ge
Deng, You Le and Man Zhuan. This cake would be made of a maocha blend
from these mountains. Kevin will correct me if I'm wrong.

I've never tried Purple Cane tea, so I have no opinion on their
pu-erh, except that they are yummy looking and pricey.

Hope it helps,
Kevin.

I also do not do multiple steeps with black teas, I brew English style with less
leaf than you'd use gongfu style, and a longer steep.
I haven't even tried with the yunnan sourcing teas, but with other black
teas--------experimenting some years ago, found the 2nd steeps were quite a bit
weaker so haven't tried again.
Now white or oolong teas........................I do the multiple steeps quite
successfully-------perhaps because I use cooler water???

Jan Ellis


----- Original Message ----- ---------
Meaning multiple steeps? I confess I don't tend to brew Yunnan this way,
exception being the ITC Imperial Gold. Or, meaning their characters staying
intact
after long-term storage? This is the first Yunnan Sourcing Yunnans I've had,
so if the latter, I just haven't experienced that yet. And at the greedy rate
I drink Yunnan...hmmm...well....

But I am thinking you meant the former based on your previous post. And I
just haven't experimented with these teas in this way. Yet. P'rhaps I should.
It's an interesting question and might be a way to further pinpoint what their
differences are.

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I've attended some of the 12-step (steep) meetings that Adrain
mentions.  A Yixing mug in the meeting room has my name magic-markered
onto it.  I usualy show up late with my friend, Dian Hong. When I ogle
a shapely calabash, she comes unglued.  I must confess that sometimes
I show up reeking like a tea-brewery.

Some time back I asked the world at large for their brewing
suggestions on Yunnan Gold.  I received three responses:

Parameter One: 7oz vessel, 4g of Yunnan Gold, full boil, three full
minutes, just one infusion.

Parameter Two: 1g of Yunnan Gold per 2oz of boiling water.  Infusion
times: 90s, 90s, 180s, 240s

Parameter Three: 4g of tea in a 12oz pot. Infusion times: 4m, 4m, 5m.

I alternate between Parameter One and Parameter Two, based upon
whether I feel rich.  Parameter Three I've yet to try, though I should.

During a cha-zui buying frenzy, I found three favorites--based on cost
and quality: SRT, Yunnan Sourcing, and (surprise!) Adagio.  Wonderful
people sent me generous samples of tremendous Yunnan Gold from their
travels to exotic locations, but alas, I cannot order from those
non-Internet, non-Engish-speaking purveyors.

All the best,
~geraldo98765

>Which yunnan black is this??  I went
>to the site and they have only the golden
>tips, sold out, and a wild harvest black. I
>am still looking for that peppery yunnan
>black that I used to get over 5 years ago.
> Jan Ellis

Hi Jan,
I could be wrong and probably am but it seems to
me that the pepperies are easy to find; it's the
maplelies you have to expend effort searching out.
Michael

on 5/1/06 15:10, Masaharu Ellis at masajanellis@... wrote:

> I have heard that IPOT's superior yunnan fancy is very good-----------but I
> also find their prices high .   I try to find better than average teas that
> are still a good value, and although that tea is within what I spend for a
> special occasion tea, it is not what I spend for everyday teas. (I just may
> break down and try it though.)  I have found that once I get used to an
> exceptional tea I have difficulty with ones within the price range I choose so
> I have to be careful not to get used those teas.

I think the IPOT offering is about the best I've
tasted. Rumor has it that the Pu'erh frenzy is
driving energy away from the production of
excellent Yunnan red teas, but they will never
disappear.

> I must admit that my budget for teas has been going up as my taste buds become
> more 'picky' so who knows what I'll be doing next year.
>
> My other favorite tea is a good keemun (non-smoky) and they also really vary.
> Probably one of my favorites is the keemun Jin Zhen  I got from Zdenek last
> year----light and sweet with great complexity.

Mine too. I love Kemmun teas in nearly all of
their manifestations.
>
> Or..........my taste buds run to the mocha keemun related teas-----like a good
> golden monkey---for winter , which is when I drink the richer yunnans as
> well..
>
> I guess half the fun is the search, and if the teas end up not being to my
> particular taste buds, I aways can find someone who appreciates them.  And
> look at all the great  people we meet in the process.

Yup. Yup. And yup again.
>
> Jan in Portland, who is drinking a golden monkey at the moment---a lighter
> one.

I've got a beautiful Rohini FF here with me at the
moment, behaving admirably well in its slightly
out of focus grainy softness, and it's tingy finish.

Michael

[Masaharu]
> All in all, finding a very high quality tea at a affordable price is a small
> miracle.

Not necessarily. I've found really excellent Keemuns at
*very* reasonable prices. Young agable sheng Pu'erhs
are often well within most people's price ranges. Wonderful
fresh flavorful green teas without fancy names and reputations
(such as Long Jings and Bi Lo Chuns) are often very affordable.
Outliers are your best economic bet. Vendors provide samples.
The trick is to stay away from the big names, plan your Pu'erhs
in advance, and buy at the right season. Other examples abound.

Just my thoughts.

Michael

In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:36:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mplant@... writes:

think the IPOT offering is about the best I've
tasted. Rumor has it that the Pu'erh frenzy is
driving energy away from the production of
excellent Yunnan red teas, but they will never
disappear.
-----------
Have you tasted it since January of this year? That is when my reaction to
this tea radically changed (as well retasting a sample amount some time after
that). This tea had been my favorite, but there was a change for the negative in
a distinct way (not a subtle way, which I've come to accept as just how it
goes) from my January order on. I keep wondering at what point it might go back
to its former glory.

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:41:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mplant@... writes:

Wonderful
fresh flavorful green teas without fancy names and reputations
(such as Long Jings and Bi Lo Chuns) are often very affordable
-----
I've been drinking a Silk Road Tea Tongyu Mountain Green that falls into that
latter category I think. In fact, I might have been persuaded to try this one
again (first time I tried it some years back it smelled exactly like my
grandpa's denim coat he wore in the barn--cigarette smoky!) by more recent
remarks
by either/or Michael or Lew. This current tea I am drinking is *entirely
unlike that* first cigarette-y experience, which truly was so intensely so I
wondered if the maker had dropped some of his ash into the leaf as he worked.
:-)

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

--- Michael Plant <mplant@...> wrote:

> on 5/1/06 15:10, Masaharu Ellis at
> masajanellis@... wrote:

snip

> >
> > My other favorite tea is a good keemun (non-smoky)
> and they also really vary.
> > Probably one of my favorites is the keemun Jin
> Zhen  I got from Zdenek last
> > year----light and sweet with great complexity.
>
> Mine too. I love Kemmun teas in nearly all of
> their manifestations.
> >
> > Or..........my taste buds run to the mocha keemun
> related teas-----like a good
> > golden monkey---for winter , which is when I drink
> the richer yunnans as
> > well..
> >
> > I guess half the fun is the search, and if the
> teas end up not being to my
> > particular taste buds, I aways can find someone
> who appreciates them.  And
> > look at all the great  people we meet in the
> process.
>
> Yup. Yup. And yup again.
> >
> > Jan in Portland, who is drinking a golden monkey
> at the moment---a lighter
> > one.
>
> I've got a beautiful Rohini FF here with me at the
> moment, behaving admirably well in its slightly
> out of focus grainy softness, and it's tingy finish.
>
> Michael
>



This is the first time that I'm aware of it that I've
seen someone make this distinction explicitly (I
probably jsut wasn't paying attention) but that
explains to me what my problem with Keemuns has been.
I got some Keemun Mao Feng from Upton way back two or
three years ago when I started on teas seriously, and
it was chocolatey and wonderful, I loved it. Then I
got some Keemun Hao Ya from another source and again
more recently (maybe a year ago?) from Specialteas and
it was very smokey and not to my liking...can anyone
recommend a consistantly "chocolate" Keemun or is the
difference here in the Mao Feng vs. Hao Ya? I don't
care for Lapsang-type or smokey type tastes excepts
very occasionally (though I seem to be able to accept
it in sheng puers more often) and I miss that
chocolate taste. I know the Golden Monkey and, more
expensively, the Emperoro's Red from Specialteas has
it but alas it is quite expensive....but very
good...but it's expensive...but, oh it's good...:D
(_horns of a dilemma_)

I am amazed at the synchronicities in this tea
group...I just ordered some of the Yunnan Gold Tips
and the Black Gold (not the compressed ) from YS and
here I have other's impressions all ready for me to
taste against. :) Lovely. I also got some of the
Tibetian Flame mushroom cooked pu-er that I've been
wanting to try for ages. I have to dig out my puer
from my moving boxes...I am getting that craving...

Melinda, drinking coffee (urg) because it's too early
and still discombobulated from the move. Where the
hell are my DISHES.....

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In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:10:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mplant@... writes:

seems to
me that the pepperies are easy to find; it's the
maplelies you have to expend effort searching out.
---------
..and oddly enough, I find just the opposite! :-) Which makes one wonder if,
again, it all falls back on individual perceptions of those elusive flavors
and aromas in tea!!! I'd think I was way wet regarding the peppery, except
others seem to remember a range of spice in Yunnan similar to mine that just
seems
to have been lost. The last few years I have found that range of spice missing
in the Sechuan Zao Bei Jian I used to favor, too.

I have even pondered if the peppery was/is truly a flavor note or, rather,
connected to the astringency factor in the teas...the pungent, puckery
characteristic that makes the mind translate it as "pepper?" When I found this
in the
Yunnan teas years back, I was drinking far more of the less solidly golden
mellow Yunnans and drinking more of the "salt and pepper" colored ones, with
higher proportion of black leaf mixed with golden tip. Hmmmm. But, I still
recall
peppery as more than mere sensation--I truly remember it as a flavor note
since, sometimes, a Yunnan would strike me as spicy, but not in the way of
pepper;
instead, some few Yunnan teas would have a spice note I related to clove!

And so...p'rhaps 'tis all a figment of the old (and getting older)
imagination...and yet...

But maple I find waaaaaaaaay easier to come by than the mythical peppery. :-)

Of late, I've found in Yunnan a mystifying range of maple sweet to honey
sweet, earth in varying proportions (clean "good earth" that is warm under the
sunshine to metallic and muddy or even damp cellar that hasn't seen the
sun)...savory-smoky-sweet (almost like a hickory smoked brown sugar
bacon!)...leathery
(as Cindy W. describes so well, like "old books")...floral as in fleshy orchid
to a range of light floral that reminds me of lavender honey...malty to a
less desirable raw grain taste...flat out smoky (which can range from very clean
and clear to not so clean)...sometimes it all comes together in that flavor I
think of as mocha...and thanks to Cindy W's description of one Yunnan seeming
to combine a sweetness with chipotle, I think I found that range too once. :-)
And probably some other stuff that's escaped me for the moment. :-)

Upton's Yunnan Imperial was my "first love" Yunnan and the tea that let me
realize what Yunnan could be about. I visited it just a few months ago and found
it lacking.

Holly H-B
_________
"The Holy Grail!. . . What is it?
The phantom of a cup that comes and goes?"
"Nay, monk, what phantom?" answered Percivale.
     Tennyson
_________


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

on 5/2/06 09:34, anodyne@... at anodyne@... wrote:

> In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:36:15 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mplant@... writes:
>
> think the IPOT offering is about the best I've
> tasted. Rumor has it that the Pu'erh frenzy is
> driving energy away from the production of
> excellent Yunnan red teas, but they will never
> disappear.
> -----------
> Have you tasted it since January of this year? That is when my reaction to
> this tea radically changed (as well retasting a sample amount some time after
> that). This tea had been my favorite, but there was a change for the negative
> in
> a distinct way (not a subtle way, which I've come to accept as just how it
> goes) from my January order on. I keep wondering at what point it might go
> back
> to its former glory.
>
> Holly H-B

No, I haven't tried it that lately. Sad.
Wonder what happened. Maybe it's
that Pu'erh frenzy rearing its ugly
head again. I've tasted the Yunnan
Sourcing Yunnans and found one
every bit as good as the old IPOT
version. It's the Golden, if I'm not
mistaken.

I think the good news is that while
Yunnan reds might be giving us a
bit of trouble, greens are lovely so
far this year.

Michael

In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:41:14 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mplant@... writes:
I've found really excellent Keemuns at
*very* reasonable prices
--------
...speaking of Keemuns, the Silk Road Tea Keemun (B-KM-2) had turned into my
daily drinking Keemun of late. This one has rather consistently (a tough job,
too) seemed to perform for me rather above its price range compared to other
Keemun teas. This was my comparison point at least in March when I purchased a
goodly amount of the SRT Keemun.

Keemun
B-KM-2
Silk Road Teas (http://www.silkroadteas.com/)
tea rcvd 3/13/06

and

Superior Keemun
Tribute Tea (http://www.tributetea.com/)
tea was the last lot I rcvd, precise date unknown

Cup to cup this morning, we have here the aforementioned two Keemun teas. One
is the affordable daily drinking Keemun of SRT and the other is TT Superior
Keemun that costs $1.95 more per quarter pound. This current 3/13/06 SRT Keemun
has moved back to the softer character I experienced in lots prior to the
last one I commented on, the one which seemed to have just a touch more
astringency and woody-bitter cocoa than the current purchase now shows.

The main difference as I taste these two together is that the TT Superior
Keemun has a much more leathery aroma than the SRT Keemun. The SRT Keemun shows
a
softer range--milk chocolate/toasty/honeyed in contrast to the TT Superior
Keemun's sweet/leathery emphasis. It is odd in that until I compared these two,
I hadn't called the TT one leathery at all! But today that latter
characteristic sings forth.

Compared to the TeaGschwendner "Historical Anhui Keemun," I had found the TT
Superior Keemun's aroma less "earth-bound" with some malty notes in the cup as
well as a touch of honey and hint of floral. But this shows how relative
comparisons can be since, against the softer SRT Keemun, the TT Superior Keemun
suddenly reflects the leathery note that I hadn't even picked up on before.
While SRT Keemun strikes me as milk chocolate in aroma, the cup still veers off
toward cocoa. Either this new SRT purchase truly is softer than the previous
quarter pound that I had, or I have simply tweaked the brewing in some way I am
unaware of--again the SRT Keemun, as in times past, has the hint of something
fruity-woody that I found appealing. TT Superior Keemun's leathery note
translates as less soft in the cup comparatively, and this tea shows somewhat
more
astringency today than the SRT Keemun. But it is still not out of proportion for
pleasurable drinking. These are two slightly different Keemun teas here in
which flavors/aromas they present and in what garment--leather versus something
a bit silky--they present them.  --end of notes--

We have a pot of the SRT Keemun this rainy May morning, in fact, and the
aroma is very full. Some other Keemun teas in this price range would be doing
the
smoky/cardboard/"earth-bound" thing only.

Holly H-B


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Note that I wrote 'very' high quality.  You are correct, there are some really
nice teas at reasonable prices----I have found many and am always on the lookout
for more.  But there are also some really 'top' quality ones that I just have to
pass by because of the price.  that said, quality and price don't always go
together.  I've tasted some expensive ones that I didn't care for at all.

I must say that I have never been hurting for good tea in my household, not yet
anyway.
I enjoy the SRT keemun and Tribute Tea's keemun as well as the one from Zdenek. 
I do find they vary some from year to year as can be expected, and haven't
ordered from Silk Road this year.  I think also Tribute Tea has gotten a new
batch in and I haven't tried that.

I am a bit limited in my taste for keemun because I don't like smoke in mine and
many do have that.  Not a comment on quality, just my personal taste (unless I
am out camping, then the smoke just seems to fit right in)


----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Plant
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/2/2006 3:40:45 AM
Subject: Re: [tea-disc] Good Quality and Service


[Masaharu]
> All in all, finding a very high quality tea at a affordable price is a small
> miracle.

Not necessarily. I've found really excellent Keemuns at
*very* reasonable prices. Young agable sheng Pu'erhs
are often well within most people's price ranges. Wonderful
fresh flavorful green teas without fancy names and reputations
(such as Long Jings and Bi Lo Chuns) are often very affordable.
Outliers are your best economic bet. Vendors provide samples.
The trick is to stay away from the big names, plan your Pu'erhs
in advance, and buy at the right season. Other examples abound.

Just my thoughts.

Michael




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I hear lots of descriptions of peppery------but when I try them, I don't taste
it.  I'd think it was just my taste buds changing, except that many others have
said the same thing.  The whole yunnan style seems to have turned to the gold
style, which is wonderful as well, just different---more fresh, more mild, more
sweet.

There is, then, that really rich, mapley factor (that the IPOT yunnan used to
have), where the leaf looks powdery and rich itself, that is hard to find as
well-------more rich than these clean, sweet drinking gold yunnans.

I hope it has to do somewhat with the weather that year, as opposed to the style
of producing the tea???

Jan


----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Plant
To: tea-disc@yahoogroups.com
Sent: 5/2/2006 3:10:55 AM
Subject: [tea-disc] Yunnan Blacks


>Which yunnan black is this??  I went
>to the site and they have only the golden
>tips, sold out, and a wild harvest black. I
>am still looking for that peppery yunnan
>black that I used to get over 5 years ago.
> Jan Ellis

Hi Jan,
I could be wrong and probably am but it seems to
me that the pepperies are easy to find; it's the
maplelies you have to expend effort searching out.
Michael



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

on 5/2/06 10:07, anodyne@... at anodyne@... wrote:

> In a message dated 5/2/2006 6:10:25 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> mplant@... writes:
>
> seems to
> me that the pepperies are easy to find; it's the
> maplelies you have to expend effort searching out.
> ---------
> ..and oddly enough, I find just the opposite! :-)


I find this very interesting indeed. Perhaps others
could chime in with their experiences in this
weighty matter. It's possible that my maple
craving demands a higher degree of mapleliness.
Or perhaps I've missed the subtlety of peppery.

Michael